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<H1>[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</H1>
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<LI><em>To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
<LI><em>Subject</em>: [MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</LI>
<LI><em>From</em>: Hal Black <<A HREF="mailto:hal#moos,ml.org">hal#moos,ml.org</A>></LI>
<LI><em>Date</em>: Wed, 30 Sep 1998 21:30:35 -0400</LI>
<LI><em>Reply-To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
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<PRE>
On Tue, Sep 29, 1998 at 12:10:33PM -1000, Nathan F Yospe wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Sep 1998, Hal Black wrote:
>
> :Someone has to make the universe rules. And the game engine is your tool for
> :making that reality manifest to immerse players in it. Surely you shouldn't
> :have to tell players this... But what happens when some circumstance happens
> :that they DO end up outside? Either you can monitor the game all the time as
> :the admin and type stuff in (which I'd never attempt) or you can code it once
> :and let the players play and let the engine take care of this kind of thing.
>
> Bingo. Either another convert, or convergent design.
8') Convergent design in this case I think. I've been planning this sort of
thing for some time, since before I joined the list. Looks like you are doing
some excellent stuff with Physmud from what I have read in the archives.
Can't wait to see it in action.
> :What???
> : I just said that if they are different, they get different perceptions.
[...]
> :if (character.body.can_see()) character.render(VISION,room.desc);
> :if (character.body.can_smell()) character.render(SMELL,room.scent);
>
> :In a nutshell: if Mark can't smell, he doesn't get smell messages!!!
> : if Sam can't see, he doesn't get vision messages!!!
>
> Of course, you might want to make this less absolute... see my (superceded)
> earlier design with a sensory level based markup language... now consider a
> version that takes into account lighting levels, etc...
I absolutely plan to do it that way. The aim above was to have a very simple
example for purposes of illustration and brevity. The real model will have
different types of energy at different magnitudes. Maybe a member of a canid
race will be able to hear that thief sneaking up behind him because of his
acute hearing, while a human might not, etc.
> :> Hal Black :
> :> >Sam in his spacesuit.
>
> :> >Sam in a leaky spacesuit.
>
> :> see above ;)
>
> :Here is some pseudo-code for you to implement this. What's good about it is
> :that you only have to implement the body once, and it will work in any
> :environment. There are other, more sophisticated, ways to do this too, so that
> :vampires don't breathe, for instance if you don't want them to breathe in your
> :world. I am trying to be brief here.
>
> : body human interfaces living {
> : breathe {
> : if (not breathable(environment.air)) {
> : choke();
> : }
> : call(1 seconds, breathe);
> : }
> : bool breathable(gas theGas) {
> : if theGas = earthlike return true;
> : else return false;
> : }
> : }
>
> : environment room {
> : theAir = smoky;
> : gas air() {
> : if (body.in_sealed_container())
> : return body.container.environment.air();
> : else
> : return theAir;
> : }
> : }
>
> : environment suit {
> : gas air() {
> : if (punctured)
> : return (environment.air());
> : else
> : return earthlike;
> : }
> : }
>
> :So it is kinda messy wrt to variable names and type names... sue me, it's
> :pseudo-code. 8')
>
> And looks suspiciously java-inspired. Or is that just me? :)
Caught red handed. 8')
Yup, current (non)working code is in Java.
> :> Dont you see though, that "viewer specific" descriptions do this just
> :> as forcefully, and "un-correctly" as a static one. The only difference is
> :> whoever
> :> wrote the specific descriptions tried to get inside that viewers character
> :> more than one time. He just colored thousands more descriptions with his
> :> own personal ideas, prejudices, understandings, than the person that
> :> writes one. Those "viewer specific" descriptions are no more accurate
> :> or entertaining than one, in fact, they have intruded so much, that now
> :> wherever I go, im told, "for my specific circumstances" what I see, hear
> :> etc. Cant I get a chance to do that? Why does the game engine have to kick
> :> me out of my character in each room, and tell me specifically for my character
> :> now, what i see, hear, etc..
>
> :I have never advocated that the game engine should take you out of your
> :character and tell you how you feel. However, the physical body of your
> :character will - IN SOME CASES - bias your viewpoint. The engine can give
>
> Yes. In fact... well, if you look in the archives, you'll even see posts
> about implementing "blind rage" and the like, along with player-intelligence
> based perception...
Yes, there is a very interesting post in the archives somewhere about using
player intervention to override instinctive action by the character. (search
for Kzin) That is a very cool feature I'd like to add for some of the advanced
roleplaying races.
> :> Im going to use a simple principle here :
>
> :> Akhams Razor.
> :
> :Actually it's either Ockham's or Occam's Razor in English.
>
> Occam's. I'm a scientist. I use
There are actually two accepted spellings as mentioned above. I don't think
they were as strict about spelling back in the day as we are now.
> :Occam was born before there were things like quantum physics. 8')
>
> :Since you're quoting Occam, it is interesting to note in the context of this
> :debate that he applied his theory to psychological powers distinct for each
> :mode of sense. 8')
>
> Also, the quote considered only viable explanations. And quantum physics is
> pretty simple, honest. Now, high energy quantum chromodynamics... or string
> theory... or supersymmetry...
Heh. I wish I knew more about that kind of thing. I'm an EE so at least
I could have taken some solid state, but I took more math instead. Only
so much time I guess.
</PRE>
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<UL>
<LI><STRONG><A NAME="01315" HREF="msg01315.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</A></STRONG>
<UL><LI><EM>From:</EM> Hal Black <hal#moos,ml.org></LI></UL></LI>
<LI><STRONG><A NAME="01371" HREF="msg01371.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</A></STRONG>
<UL><LI><EM>From:</EM> Nathan F Yospe <yospe#hawaii,edu></LI></UL></LI>
</UL></LI></UL>
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<ul><li>Thread context:
<BLOCKQUOTE><UL>
<LI><STRONG>[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</STRONG>, <EM>(continued)</EM>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01318" HREF="msg01318.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</A></strong>,
Hal Black <a href="mailto:hal#moos,ml.org">hal#moos,ml.org</a>, Mon 28 Sep 1998, 00:58 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01321" HREF="msg01321.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</A></strong>,
J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#kanga,nu">claw#kanga,nu</a>, Mon 28 Sep 1998, 02:19 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01320" HREF="msg01320.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</A></strong>,
J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#kanga,nu">claw#kanga,nu</a>, Mon 28 Sep 1998, 01:16 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01371" HREF="msg01371.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</A></strong>,
Nathan F Yospe <a href="mailto:yospe#hawaii,edu">yospe#hawaii,edu</a>, Tue 29 Sep 1998, 22:11 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01395" HREF="msg01395.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</A></strong>,
Hal Black <a href="mailto:hal#moos,ml.org">hal#moos,ml.org</a>, Thu 01 Oct 1998, 01:09 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
</ul>
</ul>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01316" HREF="msg01316.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</A></strong>,
Chris Gray <a href="mailto:cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA">cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA</a>, Sun 27 Sep 1998, 23:19 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01322" HREF="msg01322.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</A></strong>,
Adam J. Thornton <a href="mailto:adam#phoenix,Princeton.EDU">adam#phoenix,Princeton.EDU</a>, Mon 28 Sep 1998, 02:35 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01319" HREF="msg01319.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</A></strong>,
apocalypse <a href="mailto:apocalypse#pipeline,com">apocalypse#pipeline,com</a>, Mon 28 Sep 1998, 01:11 GMT
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01331" HREF="msg01331.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Room descriptions</A></strong>,
Chris Gray <a href="mailto:cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA">cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA</a>, Mon 28 Sep 1998, 14:07 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
</LI>
</UL></BLOCKQUOTE>
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