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<H1>[MUD-Dev] Re: Affordances and social method (Was: Re: Wi</H1>
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<LI><em>To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
<LI><em>Subject</em>: [MUD-Dev] Re: Affordances and social method (Was: Re: Wi </LI>
<LI><em>From</em>: J C Lawrence <<A HREF="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</A>></LI>
<LI><em>Date</em>: Wed, 16 Sep 1998 13:31:22 -0700</LI>
<LI><em>Reply-To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
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<PRE>
On Sat, 8 Aug 1998 02:55:29 -0700
quzah <quzah#geocities,com> wrote:
> From: Holly Sommer <hsommer#micro,ti.com>
>> On Fri, 7 Aug 1998, J C Lawrence wrote:
>>> On Tue, 14 Jul 1998 03:46:36 -5 Jon A
>>> Lambert<jlsysinc#ix,netcom.com> wrote:
>>>> Nod. The availability of @gag did not prevent the Mr. Bungle
>>>> incident. Nor would @gag or "squelch" affect third party
>>>> observation of such activity.
> [Snip @gag, and a bit about ignoring.]
>> This doesn't keep $person from attacking, stealing, or otherwise
>> DOING things to you - and indeed, you'd want to modify the check
>> so that you are notified of actions like that (else $person could
>> steal you blind, or you'd be in combat, and not even know it),
>> but it certainly gets around having to enture social dorks.
>>
>> Also, you could chose to send a message back to Bubba like
>> "Newman is ignoring you." for tells and emotes. This should get
>> the message across.
> Personally, I like the idea of an extreme ignore. Something like
> vanish, or perhaps, banish.
...
> Either you 'dissapear' from Bubba's life, or he from yours. Now
> you both don't exist from eachother. It would solve the harassment
> problems to some degree. However, I can think of how it may have
> problems:
> [Bubba is vanished/bannished]
> %set down backpack
> You set down your backpack.
> [Bubba just happens to wander into the room, doesn't see you, but
> sees your backpack]
> (bubba) %get backpack
> [Your screen] %switch sword to other hand (The reason for dropping
> the backpack)
> You switch your sword from your right hand, into your left.
> %grab backpack
> You look around for a backpack to grab, and don't see one.
> %say WTF?
> ... You could add an 'owner' flag to items, thus, anything owned
> by you Bubba would not see, and if after some great length of
> time, if you don't wander around and make sure the posession is
> yours, then the flag is removed.
Echoes of the Veils of Alzaroc (a brilliant book BTW).
Turn this around instead so that instead of there being flags of
ownership, there were instead weights of "degree of interaction"
both positive and negative, where use and ownership of an object
increases the weight value. Then the ability of a character to
perceive and ultimately to manipulate an object (note that
perception can occur before manipluation is possible (read the book
or see prior discussion of it here) is then a function of the
accumulation of weights on that object as modified by his identity.
If it happens that the degree weights scale against a given
character then he will quite simply not be able to see that object.
if the weights scale slightly less against him, then he may be able
to see it, but be unable to affect it in any manner.
Care or cleverness would of course have to be taken for logical
loops for when A can see/manipulate B, but B can't see/manipulate A,
or potentially far worse for Tailor scenarios: A and B can see each
other, but A can't effect B, and B can effect A. Relying in
intemediate objects would not suffice: A and B can both see but not
effect each other, but C (a dead object) can both be seen and be
affected by A and B (and ergo they can be effected by it), thus S
can attack/whatever B with C. <phew>
Data heavy and potentially (likely) compute intensive, but it
creates an extremely interesting world in which the fact and
presence of something is totally seperate from your ability to
either perceive or manipulate it. It also creates a whole new game,
a variation on Cat's attention economics, of conntrolling what other
players can or cannot see or do by causitively altering the mase
mechanics of their world view.
> I guess that would sort of fall in along the line of: Farmer A
> owns plot of land A next to Farmer B who owns plot of land B,
> Farmer B builds his fence 25 feet onto Farmer A's land. Now, in
> the good ol' US, if Farmer A doesn't notice this, or do anything
> about if for say, 10 years or something, Farmer B legaly owns that
> land that was fenced off.
Squatter's rights, or for more curious cases, "public right of way".
Australia in particular has (had?) some very aggressive laws in this
regard, heavily in favour of squatters.
> You could have the ownership flag last a varying time depending on
> the size of the object, so that a house would be owned for a long
> time, and something insignificant like a pen-knife, would loose
> its ownership value quickly if set down (say a few minutes if you
> wandered off). Which, sadly brings up another problem. Buffy buys
> a house, and a plot of land. She owns them. Bubba shows up and
> starts being an ass, which in turn causes Buffy to vanish/banish
> Bubba. Now what? Bubba is standing in the room, with the house and
> plot of land that Buffy owns, and he gets the "You're bad, now
> you're gone." message, and looks and sees... Do I make Buffy's
> house vanish for him? And what about the plot of land.
Using the veils analogy, Bubba sees some degree of a ghost of a
house which he can more or less interact with and effect.
--
J C Lawrence Internet: claw#null,net
(Contractor) Internet: coder#ibm,net
---------(*) Internet: claw#under,engr.sgi.com
...Honourary Member of Clan McFud -- Teamer's Avenging Monolith...
</PRE>
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<ul><li>Thread context:
<BLOCKQUOTE><UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00559" HREF="msg00559.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: after the plague: mud report</A></strong>,
quzah <a href="mailto:quzah#geocities,com">quzah#geocities,com</a>, Sat 08 Aug 1998, 10:19 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00624" HREF="msg00624.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: after the plague: mud report</A></strong>,
Ling <a href="mailto:K.L.Lo-94#student,lboro.ac.uk">K.L.Lo-94#student,lboro.ac.uk</a>, Mon 10 Aug 1998, 12:47 GMT
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00635" HREF="msg00635.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: after the plague: mud report</A></strong>,
Adam Wiggins <a href="mailto:adam#angel,com">adam#angel,com</a>, Mon 10 Aug 1998, 17:35 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00558" HREF="msg00558.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Affordances and social method (Was: Re: Wi</A></strong>,
quzah <a href="mailto:quzah#geocities,com">quzah#geocities,com</a>, Sat 08 Aug 1998, 10:19 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01050" HREF="msg01050.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Affordances and social method (Was: Re: Wi</A></strong>,
J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</a>, Wed 16 Sep 1998, 20:31 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00551" HREF="msg00551.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: The great crusade....</A></strong>,
brandon <a href="mailto:brandon#sedona,net">brandon#sedona,net</a>, Sat 08 Aug 1998, 04:10 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00568" HREF="msg00568.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: The great crusade....</A></strong>,
Mike Sellers <a href="mailto:mike#bignetwork,com">mike#bignetwork,com</a>, Sun 09 Aug 1998, 01:12 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00569" HREF="msg00569.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Adverts in email on the list.</A></strong>,
Ben Greear <a href="mailto:greear#cyberhighway,net">greear#cyberhighway,net</a>, Sun 09 Aug 1998, 03:06 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00627" HREF="msg00627.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Adverts in email on the list.</A></strong>,
Holly Sommer <a href="mailto:hsommer#micro,ti.com">hsommer#micro,ti.com</a>, Mon 10 Aug 1998, 14:37 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
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