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<H1>Re: [MUD-Dev] defeating twinking through game mechanics</H1>
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<LI><em>To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
<LI><em>Subject</em>: Re: [MUD-Dev] defeating twinking through game mechanics</LI>
<LI><em>From</em>: <A HREF="mailto:jolson#micron,net">jolson#micron,net</A></LI>
<LI><em>Date</em>: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:05:55 -0600</LI>
<LI><em>Reply-To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
<LI><em>Sender</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev-admin#kanga,nu">mud-dev-admin#kanga,nu</A></LI>
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<PRE>
----- Original Message -----
From: "S. Patrick Gallaty" <choke#sirius,com>
> One of the design failures IMO in everquest is that it follows the
> old 'weaponcode' model of weapon damage. I.e. one hits for the
> 'max damage' of the weapon rather than any sort of measure of
> player skill. This means the weapon is tantamount. Nothing
> matters except for the weapon stats, in the end. With armor the
> same way, you have created a game where heavy twinking is
> inevitable.
Heavy twinking seems inevitable in *any* system without hard limits
(even such as you've proposed below) where items have significant
importance to a character's abilities or identity. "So what if I can't
get full effect from my Megasword - it's better than what I had, and
more importantly it *looks* cool." The mechanical problems of heavy
twinking can be solved for the most part, but the negative social
effects would seem to remain.
Brad McQuaid once said that he was against item level limits in
EverQuest because he liked the idea that a low level player could,
through heroic cunning and skill, defeat a creature twice his level and
reap the reward in the form of a fantastic item. A romantic thought to
be sure, but in EverQuest such a deed became all but impossible.
Between dramatic differences in skill efficacy between levels and mobs
that can teleport when stuck, nothing short of outright cheating or
active assistance from high level players would make such a thing
possible.
EverQuest has since implemented level limits in various forms, from
magic weapons that won't proc their effects until a certain level to no-
drop, no-trade items that come from level-restricted zones.
> I'll throw out an alternative system here, and let you guys kick
> it around. We did something like this on EOTL, but I think it
> could have been better.
I was an archwizard on EOTL and I remember the beginnings of this
debate. From what I remember, a number of weapons (purple sword, rusty
cleaver) had been created by various wizards that were unreasonably
powerful for the mobs from which they were acquired. Interestingly,
the debate started not to institute a remedy for twinking, but to
define standards for equipment design and availability so wizards would
stop creating so many uberweapons.
-Josh Olson
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<li><strong><A NAME="00482" HREF="msg00482.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] defeating twinking through game mechanics</A></strong>
<ul compact><li><em>From:</em> <adam@treyarch.com></li></ul>
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<ul><li>Thread context:
<BLOCKQUOTE><UL>
<LI><STRONG>[MUD-Dev] [Mud-Dev]: Sushi Mud</STRONG>, <EM>(continued)</EM>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00486" HREF="msg00486.html">[MUD-Dev] [Mud-Dev]: Sushi Mud</A></strong>,
Todd McKimmey <a href="mailto:rufus@wombatgames.com">rufus@wombatgames.com</a>, Thu 20 Apr 2000, 22:08 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
</ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00478" HREF="msg00478.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Database back ends</A></strong>,
Kevin Littlejohn <a href="mailto:darius@connect.com.au">darius@connect.com.au</a>, Wed 19 Apr 2000, 23:15 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00468" HREF="msg00468.html">[MUD-Dev] defeating twinking through game mechanics</A></strong>,
S. Patrick Gallaty <a href="mailto:choke@sirius.com">choke@sirius.com</a>, Wed 19 Apr 2000, 18:55 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00488" HREF="msg00488.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] defeating twinking through game mechanics</A></strong>,
Travis S. Casey <a href="mailto:efindel@io.com">efindel@io.com</a>, Thu 20 Apr 2000, 22:08 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
<UL>
<li><Possible follow-up(s)><br>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00480" HREF="msg00480.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] defeating twinking through game mechanics</A></strong>,
jolson <a href="mailto:jolson@micron.net">jolson@micron.net</a>, Thu 20 Apr 2000, 00:09 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00482" HREF="msg00482.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] defeating twinking through game mechanics</A></strong>,
adam <a href="mailto:adam@treyarch.com">adam@treyarch.com</a>, Thu 20 Apr 2000, 01:34 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00487" HREF="msg00487.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] defeating twinking through game mechanics</A></strong>,
S. Patrick Gallaty <a href="mailto:choke@sirius.com">choke@sirius.com</a>, Thu 20 Apr 2000, 22:08 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00470" HREF="msg00470.html">[MUD-Dev] Fun and Learning in games</A></strong>,
Draymoor <a href="mailto:fibhufky@erols.com">fibhufky@erols.com</a>, Wed 19 Apr 2000, 18:55 GMT
<UL>
<li><Possible follow-up(s)><br>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00479" HREF="msg00479.html">RE: [MUD-Dev] Fun and Learning in games</A></strong>,
Schubert, Damion <a href="mailto:dschubert@origin.ea.com">dschubert@origin.ea.com</a>, Wed 19 Apr 2000, 23:36 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
</UL></BLOCKQUOTE>
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