<!-- MHonArc v2.4.4 --> <!--X-Subject: Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations --> <!--X-From-R13: X Q Znjerapr <pynjNxnatn.ah> --> <!--X-Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 23:30:43 -0800 --> <!--X-Message-Id: E12Eoog-0004yH-00#dingo,kanga.nu --> <!--X-Content-Type: text/plain --> <!--X-Reference: 019801bf6927$1142e160$16e9abcf#kallisti,nexon.net --> <!--X-Head-End--> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> <html> <head> <title>MUD-Dev message, Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</title> <!-- meta name="robots" content="noindex,nofollow" --> <link rev="made" href="mailto:claw#kanga,nu"> </head> <body background="/backgrounds/paperback.gif" bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000" link="#0000FF" alink="#FF0000" vlink="#006000"> <font size="+4" color="#804040"> <strong><em>MUD-Dev<br>mailing list archive</em></strong> </font> <br> [ <a href="../">Other Periods</a> | <a href="../../">Other mailing lists</a> | <a href="/search.php3">Search</a> ] <br clear=all><hr> <!--X-Body-Begin--> <!--X-User-Header--> <!--X-User-Header-End--> <!--X-TopPNI--> Date: [ <a href="msg00236.html">Previous</a> | <a href="msg00238.html">Next</a> ] Thread: [ <a href="msg00227.html">Previous</a> | <a href="msg00228.html">Next</a> ] Index: [ <A HREF="author.html#00237">Author</A> | <A HREF="#00237">Date</A> | <A HREF="thread.html#00237">Thread</A> ] <!--X-TopPNI-End--> <!--X-MsgBody--> <!--X-Subject-Header-Begin--> <H1>Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</H1> <HR> <!--X-Subject-Header-End--> <!--X-Head-of-Message--> <UL> <LI><em>To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI> <LI><em>Subject</em>: Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations </LI> <LI><em>From</em>: J C Lawrence <<A HREF="mailto:claw#kanga,nu">claw#kanga,nu</A>></LI> <LI><em>Date</em>: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 23:30:38 -0800</LI> <LI><em>Reply-To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI> <LI><em>Sender</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev-admin#kanga,nu">mud-dev-admin#kanga,nu</A></LI> </UL> <!--X-Head-of-Message-End--> <!--X-Head-Body-Sep-Begin--> <HR> <!--X-Head-Body-Sep-End--> <!--X-Body-of-Message--> <PRE> On Thu, 27 Jan 2000 16:31:49 -0800 Lovecraft <dave#darkages,com> wrote: [empowering players with political power] > Dark Ages gives players limited administrative power in in-game > context. Some players enter a hierarchy of political positions. > There are no other direct administrators; although there is a > method of owner control, which I'll state last. > <A HREF="http://www.darkages.com/play/s_politics.html">http://www.darkages.com/play/s_politics.html</A> I've not done it, but I proposed a system I called "Rank Points" here on the list a while back. Its somewhat similar to your approach <puff chest>: --<cut>-- A simple model: Player characters can award each other "rank points" (RP). Each player character is given (free) 1RP per day. A player character with sufficient RPs can be automagically promoted to a high status position. Maintaining a high status position costs a player character XXX RPs per day (automatic debit). A player caharacter can promote other player characters to other (lower) status positions. Such a promotion costs the appointing player a one time cost of YYY RPs. The promoted player has his own daily RP cost for his position. Should the high ranking player lose his position thru lack of RP's, all appointees will also lose their position as it they had failed to acquire enough RPs to maintain their own position. A junior ranked player can still appoint sub-juniours with the same mapping as above. Ergo: To survive a high ranking player must persaude many many other players to give him their daily RPs so he can keep his position. A high ranking player may appoint juniours who are then also in the same position, but can be required to funnel some portion of their collections to their appointer. --<cut>-- This idea has been raised here on list at various times, with one thread around: <A HREF="http://www.kanga.nu/archives/MUD-Dev-L/1997Q2/msg01504.html">http://www.kanga.nu/archives/MUD-Dev-L/1997Q2/msg01504.html</A> > Dark Ages mechanics of politics are a game within the game. > Players "vote" every day to support or to attack someone > attempting political power. Each vote adds political power > points, called "Clout." Enough clout allows one to attain office > for a term. (details are well summarized by a player in the Dark > Ages Library: <A HREF="http://www.darkages.com/atavism/lore/">http://www.darkages.com/atavism/lore/</A> -> Click > "Politica Dominca"). Oooo, player involvement and churn prevention. Have you had any voter disaffection, or voter apathy to a significant/noticable extent? Is the voting game effectively played by only a small (and mostly constant) minority of the players vieing among themselves, or do most players partake fairly regularly proving a more general game of politiking? > This displays a previous issue far back in this thread: partial > voting. One can vote every day. Technically, every twelve hours. > A citizen can vote for multiple persons, or for the same person > several times. A citizen can also use the mechanics to vote more > than once, by spending Clout. ObNote: I rather like Australian voting system, where one my cast several simultaneous votes for candidates. It makes for a somehwat flatter playing field which is less prone to fracturing. From: <A HREF="http://plato.itsc.adfa.edu.au/apr/ARTICLES/hrepvote.html">http://plato.itsc.adfa.edu.au/apr/ARTICLES/hrepvote.html</A> Which is under The Australian Politics Resource at: <A HREF="http://plato.itsc.adfa.edu.au/apr/">http://plato.itsc.adfa.edu.au/apr/</A> --<cut>-- A preferential voting system is used in Australian Federal and State elections. Under this system each voter not only indicates his or her candidate of first preference, but goes on to indicate who is their second choice and so on until all their preferences have been indicated. In a House of Representatives election, only one representative is elected in each electoral division. In order to be elected a candidate must recieve an absolute majority of the formal votes cast in the electoral division. This means the successful candidate must recieve at least 50% + 1 of the formal votes. When counting commences all the first preference votes are counted for each candidate. If any candidate recieves more than 50% of the first preference votes then that candidate is duly elected. If no candidate has more than half the first preference votes, then the candidate with the fewest votes is excluded. This candidate's votes are transferred to the remaining candidates on the basis of the second preference shown on these ballot papers. If still no candidate has more than 50% of the votes the candidate who now has the fewest votes is excluded and these votes are transferred to the the other candidates according to the next preference indicated on the ballot papers. This process continues until one candidate has more than half of the formal votes cast in the and is duly elected. Ballots are exhausted only when there are no further preferences indicated, at which point they are set aside from the count. A full distribution of preferences takes place in every division, even those in which a candidate has an absolute majority of first preference votes. The result of this full distribution is used to calculate the two party preferred statistics. --<cut>-- > What is an example system that is less corrupt than the tyranny of > the majority? At various times I've toyed with the idea of doing a voting system where the value of a vote was not constant, and in fact was inversely proportional to the size of the population one represented. I've not managed to work out a system that I felt was not too obviously abusable however. The intent was promote a fine grained fracturing of the political system. I continue to feel the idea is achievable, just that my base assumptions in approaching the problem are very wrong. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw#kanga,nu ----------(*) Other: coder#kanga,nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- _______________________________________________ MUD-Dev maillist - MUD-Dev#kanga,nu <A HREF="http://www.kanga.nu/lists/listinfo/mud-dev">http://www.kanga.nu/lists/listinfo/mud-dev</A> </PRE> <!--X-Body-of-Message-End--> <!--X-MsgBody-End--> <!--X-Follow-Ups--> <HR> <!--X-Follow-Ups-End--> <!--X-References--> <UL><LI><STRONG>References</STRONG>: <UL> <LI><STRONG><A NAME="00227" HREF="msg00227.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></STRONG> <UL><LI><EM>From:</EM> "Lovecraft" <dave#darkages,com></LI></UL></LI> </UL></LI></UL> <!--X-References-End--> <!--X-BotPNI--> <UL> <LI>Prev by Date: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00236.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Next by Date: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00238.html">Re: player politics (was RE: [MUD-Dev] An introduction...)</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Prev by thread: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00227.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Next by thread: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00228.html">RE: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Index(es): <UL> <LI><A HREF="index.html#00237"><STRONG>Date</STRONG></A></LI> <LI><A HREF="thread.html#00237"><STRONG>Thread</STRONG></A></LI> </UL> </LI> </UL> <!--X-BotPNI-End--> <!--X-User-Footer--> <!--X-User-Footer-End--> <ul><li>Thread context: <BLOCKQUOTE><UL> <LI><STRONG>RE: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</STRONG>, <EM>(continued)</EM> <ul compact> <ul compact> <LI><strong><A NAME="00221" HREF="msg00221.html">RE: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></strong>, Matthew Mihaly <a href="mailto:diablo#best,com">diablo#best,com</a>, Mon 24 Jan 2000, 03:32 GMT </LI> </ul> <LI><strong><A NAME="00222" HREF="msg00222.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></strong>, Dr. Cat <a href="mailto:cat#realtime,net">cat#realtime,net</a>, Mon 24 Jan 2000, 04:35 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00223" HREF="msg00223.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></strong>, Jon A. Lambert <a href="mailto:jlsysinc#ix,netcom.com">jlsysinc#ix,netcom.com</a>, Mon 24 Jan 2000, 05:33 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00227" HREF="msg00227.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></strong>, Lovecraft <a href="mailto:dave#darkages,com">dave#darkages,com</a>, Fri 28 Jan 2000, 02:40 GMT <UL> <LI><strong><A NAME="00237" HREF="msg00237.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></strong>, J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#kanga,nu">claw#kanga,nu</a>, Sun 30 Jan 2000, 07:30 GMT </LI> </UL> </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00228" HREF="msg00228.html">RE: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></strong>, Geoffrey A. MacDougall <a href="mailto:geoffrey#poptronik,com">geoffrey#poptronik,com</a>, Fri 28 Jan 2000, 05:01 GMT <UL> <LI><strong><A NAME="00233" HREF="msg00233.html">RE: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></strong>, Marian Griffith <a href="mailto:gryphon#iaehv,nl">gryphon#iaehv,nl</a>, Sat 29 Jan 2000, 20:52 GMT <UL> <LI><strong><A NAME="00244" HREF="msg00244.html">RE: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></strong>, Matthew Mihaly <a href="mailto:diablo#best,com">diablo#best,com</a>, Sun 30 Jan 2000, 21:44 GMT </LI> </UL> </LI> </UL> </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00229" HREF="msg00229.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Community Relations</A></strong>, Lovecraft <a href="mailto:dave#darkages,com">dave#darkages,com</a>, Fri 28 Jan 2000, 22:22 GMT </LI> </ul> </LI> </UL></BLOCKQUOTE> </ul> <hr> <center> [ <a href="../">Other Periods</a> | <a href="../../">Other mailing lists</a> | <a href="/search.php3">Search</a> ] </center> <hr> </body> </html>