<!-- MHonArc v2.4.4 --> <!--X-Subject: [MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when. --> <!--X-From-R13: "Ybfgre, Dncu" <exbfgreNbevtva.rn.pbz> --> <!--X-Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 08:03:10 -0800 --> <!--X-Message-Id: 11A17AA2B9EAD111BCEA00A0C9B41793EDC990#forest,origin.ea.com --> <!--X-Content-Type: text/plain --> <!--X-Head-End--> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> <html> <head> <title>MUD-Dev message, [MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</title> <!-- meta name="robots" content="noindex,nofollow" --> <link rev="made" href="mailto:rkoster#origin,ea.com"> </head> <body background="/backgrounds/paperback.gif" bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000" link="#0000FF" alink="#FF0000" vlink="#006000"> <font size="+4" color="#804040"> <strong><em>MUD-Dev<br>mailing list archive</em></strong> </font> <br> [ <a href="../">Other Periods</a> | <a href="../../">Other mailing lists</a> | <a href="/search.php3">Search</a> ] <br clear=all><hr> <!--X-Body-Begin--> <!--X-User-Header--> <!--X-User-Header-End--> <!--X-TopPNI--> Date: [ <a href="msg00189.html">Previous</a> | <a href="msg00191.html">Next</a> ] Thread: [ <a href="msg00189.html">Previous</a> | <a href="msg00191.html">Next</a> ] Index: [ <A HREF="author.html#00190">Author</A> | <A HREF="#00190">Date</A> | <A HREF="thread.html#00190">Thread</A> ] <!--X-TopPNI-End--> <!--X-MsgBody--> <!--X-Subject-Header-Begin--> <H1>[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</H1> <HR> <!--X-Subject-Header-End--> <!--X-Head-of-Message--> <UL> <LI><em>To</em>: "'<A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A>'" <<A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A>></LI> <LI><em>Subject</em>: [MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when. </LI> <LI><em>From</em>: "Koster, Raph" <<A HREF="mailto:rkoster#origin,ea.com">rkoster#origin,ea.com</A>></LI> <LI><em>Date</em>: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 09:58:14 -0600</LI> <LI><em>Reply-To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI> </UL> <!--X-Head-of-Message-End--> <!--X-Head-Body-Sep-Begin--> <HR> <!--X-Head-Body-Sep-End--> <!--X-Body-of-Message--> <PRE> > -----Original Message----- > From: Andy Cink [<A HREF="mailto:ranthor#earthlink,net">mailto:ranthor#earthlink,net</A>] > Sent: Thursday, January 14, 1999 5:52 PM > To: mud-dev#kanga,nu > Subject: [MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when. > > > At 09:50 AM 1/14/99 -0600, Koster, Raph wrote: > >You made a lot of interesting points, but I've got to > seriously quibble > >with this notion: > > > >> If they want to start over, let them make a new > >> character) > > > >I have been playing the same "character" on muds and in > standalone RPGs > >for fifteen YEARS now. Virtually everyone I know has done the same > >thing. Character persistence and identity is not something > to mess with. > >If in order to obtain the full depth from the game, you are > REQUIRED to > >abandon a previous sense of identity, many will not make the leap. > > Well, I have to admit, I think I underestimated just how much a > person may want to hang on to their character. All the same, though, > don't many of these people have a certain type of character in mind? > For example, let's say I have a character I like to play > named Ranthor. > Ranthor is always an elven ranger. Assuming I like Ranthor and I play > Ranthor on every mud I possibly can, doesn't it seem inconsistent that > I would want to jump ladders, and become Ranthor the cleric? Not that > I couldn't, but wouldn't it be inconsistent with the character I'm > currently playing? Sure. For example, I tend to always play Dusty, a bard, and have been doing so for years now. (Interestingly, she used to be a thief, back in the mid-80s or so, and was male, and was named Rusty instead--the "character" was largely the smae however). But Dusty in different games, based on the class restraints, has taken different forms. On Worlds of Carnage she was a ranger who used a lot of emotes, because there were no bardic skills. On Legend I made a point of coding in bardic skills so she could be what she was supposed to be. On UO, Dusty is still a bard, but she's also a tailor because it was a good way to make money. Now, changing to cleric isn't likely, but I can easily see Dusty acquiring some clerical skills, *as long as she doesn't have to surrender being a bard*. Hence the advantage to having "side ladders" or the ability to pick up secondary skills. I can try new things without actually surrendering the core identity. > Let's pretend I was a 45 year old nuclear physicist, and I decided I > was bored with my job, and wanted to go into genetics. I'm getting > rather old, but I've still got time enough to do it. What carryover > value will my career in nuclear physics have to biology? Virtually > none, I would really be better off (in a mudding world, anyways) > to just "start over" as a biologist instead. If you really wanted to > make your character into a biologist, would there be a significant > difference in loss between "jumping ladders" and starting over? I > guess it depends on the design of the game system. In a case this drastic (like, say, if I wanted to change Dusty from a bard into a necromancer) the difference would be mostly psychological. The question of whether I want to invest substantial amounts of effort into creating another alter ego, or whether I am more comfortable remaining with the persona I have established over so many years. One handy way to define mules is, are they characters in which you feel invested? > In a AD&D like system (which still is at the roots of a great many > muds out there today), there's not a significant difference between > starting a new character, and returning an old character to level > 1 in a new class. (There are some differences, and you do pick up > your old class abilities at a future point, but in terms of stats, > there is little change in values. (if any, at all) In a more detailed > system, perhaps a person could change ladders in a minor sort of way, > and carry over part of their old class skills to their new class. > (Maybe a ranger becomes a druid, and some of their nature oriented > skills remain intact, or whatnot) Right--and in a classless system, or say an atrophy based system, the changeover could easily be gradual, and you could be "climbing" two ladders at once, or whatever. [snip interesting analysis of character interdependence] -Raph </PRE> <!--X-Body-of-Message-End--> <!--X-MsgBody-End--> <!--X-Follow-Ups--> <HR> <!--X-Follow-Ups-End--> <!--X-References--> <!--X-References-End--> <!--X-BotPNI--> <UL> <LI>Prev by Date: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00189.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Next by Date: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00191.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Prev by thread: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00189.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Next by thread: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00191.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Index(es): <UL> <LI><A HREF="index.html#00190"><STRONG>Date</STRONG></A></LI> <LI><A HREF="thread.html#00190"><STRONG>Thread</STRONG></A></LI> </UL> </LI> </UL> <!--X-BotPNI-End--> <!--X-User-Footer--> <!--X-User-Footer-End--> <ul><li>Thread context: <BLOCKQUOTE><UL> <LI><STRONG>[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</STRONG>, <EM>(continued)</EM> <ul compact> <ul compact> <LI><strong><A NAME="00185" HREF="msg00185.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></strong>, J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</a>, Fri 15 Jan 1999, 04:43 GMT </LI> </ul> <LI><strong><A NAME="00182" HREF="msg00182.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></strong>, Matt Wallace <a href="mailto:matt#ender,com">matt#ender,com</a>, Fri 15 Jan 1999, 04:29 GMT <UL> <LI><strong><A NAME="00202" HREF="msg00202.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></strong>, J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</a>, Sat 16 Jan 1999, 03:53 GMT </LI> </UL> </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00189" HREF="msg00189.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></strong>, Koster, Raph <a href="mailto:rkoster#origin,ea.com">rkoster#origin,ea.com</a>, Fri 15 Jan 1999, 15:54 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00190" HREF="msg00190.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></strong>, Koster, Raph <a href="mailto:rkoster#origin,ea.com">rkoster#origin,ea.com</a>, Fri 15 Jan 1999, 16:03 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00191" HREF="msg00191.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></strong>, Koster, Raph <a href="mailto:rkoster#origin,ea.com">rkoster#origin,ea.com</a>, Fri 15 Jan 1999, 16:11 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00217" HREF="msg00217.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></strong>, Adam Wiggins <a href="mailto:adam#angel,com">adam#angel,com</a>, Mon 18 Jan 1999, 19:58 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00232" HREF="msg00232.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Levels versus Skills, who uses them and when.</A></strong>, Caliban Tiresias Darklock <a href="mailto:caliban#darklock,com">caliban#darklock,com</a>, Wed 20 Jan 1999, 21:05 GMT <UL> <LI><strong><A NAME="00240" HREF="msg00240.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: META: List peerage and behaviour</A></strong>, J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</a>, Thu 21 Jan 1999, 03:49 GMT </LI> </UL> </LI> </ul> </LI> </UL></BLOCKQUOTE> </ul> <hr> <center> [ <a href="../">Other Periods</a> | <a href="../../">Other mailing lists</a> | <a href="/search.php3">Search</a> ] </center> <hr> </body> </html>