Have you actually tried viewing that snippet?

It seems to be corrupted.

Downloading it works, but for some reason it's not recognized as a text file for viewing. Hrm.

Ya that happened to the snippet I uploaded the other day, and it's a .txt file. O_o

Mostly, it's stubbornness. :)

I posted a while back about the idea of developing a linux distribution specifically designed to work AS a MUD. Instead of a single process that mimics half the OS, you'd use the OS for its strengths. The whole system of accounts, security, telnet/ssh, terminal handling… that's already done and extremely well tested. The "MUD" would boil down to a server process that tracks and manages the game state, and a custom shell which could work much like bash does now, but it also talks to this server process. Admins could use whatever editor they liked, and write commands in any language they wanted to. There would be pie for everyone!

Now, contrast the complexity of that with the struggle I had a year or two back, just trying to convince people to switch from using "\n\r" to the TELNET-compliant "\r\n", which is just a simple global search-and-replace! Pages and pages of "But… BoffoMUD did it that was for 15 years!" and "It can't be wrong, everyone does it!". Even linking the RFC's still didn't convince people.

Soooooo, yeah. I agree. Switching to character-mode would open up a whole new set of abilities for doing cool things without needing custom clients. It should be easy enough to grab a pty and tie it to a socket, then use telnet NAWS to get the terminal type and hook in termcap/termlib to give you full screen control. I'd love to see it. I won't hold my breath, as they nay-sayers will gripe about it breaking tinyfugue or Bubba's MUD Client from 1994.

On another note, thanks for the input guys! Keep it coming! There's at least a couple up there I haven't looked at before, so this thread is being helpful, and hopefully not just for me. :)

Out of curiosity, is there a Smaug port of a recent Oasis and/or DG Scripts system? I saw the old port, but I'm not even sure if that's compatible with a current SmaugFUSS, and replacing mobprogs with DG might be a feasable idea as well, although perhaps a bit more invasive. One assumes the hooks are similar, although perhaps DG has more of them, or wants more data.

Very fond of Oasis OLC DG Scripts.


As for an earlier comment by Kayle:



DG can do 'most' anything (and yes I do mean most, not just some things, I could code a class and/or race system in DG if I wished since on tba they are attachable to PC's, not just NPC's, rooms, and objects) the other languages you listed can (in a MUD environment anyway, obviously not anything in general), though admittedly they on the other hand can do anything. The difference though is that one of the main draws of DG is its simplicity. DG is simple enough to use on a basic level for your average builder while being flexible enough for a coder to use for far more complex applications whereas all of the interpreted languages you mentioned are in my eyes entirely out of most builder's comfort zone. Scripts should hands down in my eyes be usable by builders so as to lessen the work load of the coder, if the coder has to write all of the MUDs scripts then I see little reason to not just hard-code all of it.




Yes, tbaMUD and CWG have buildwalk, stock Circle itself doesn't, but stock Circle doesn't even have OLC so that's not really surprising.

In my opinion Lua, Python, or Ruby could all be very simple to accomplish typical operations you'd be able to do in DG scripts or even mprogs. Indeed the ins and outs of the language wouldn't even need to be known. Just a simple understanding of the function calls intended for use within the system itself. The most used ones you can count on one or two hands.


Oh, 1,000th post btw. :)

If some of the idiots that play WoW can work with Lua to customize their UI, I'm pretty sure, with a decent framework and helpfiles, Builder's could work with Lua.



Oasis? Not that I'm aware of. DG? I'd thought about it, and then decided Lua would be more fun. Kiasyn's actually working on embedding Lua into a SmaugFUSS base, Which we'll hopefully be able to release and continue to work on as something like SmaugFUSS++ or something. And slowly convert the whole base to use the features of the STL and the like.

Eh, just to be factually correct a very small percentage of people who play WoW ever deal with Lua. It's almost universal that people simply use published addons to customize their UI. These addons are actually written by an incredably small population of the whole—unless you mean that actually all WoW players are idiots. In which case I'd think you'd be jaded.

Not all of them are idiots. But the majority of the Addon Authors that I met seemed incredibly retarded.

Suppose it depends what type of things you'd consider to be typical really. mprogs from everything I have seen are truly very limited in use, but I've seen things done with DG that relatively new coders might have serious problems trying to hardcode even let alone a builder scripting them in luda/python/ruby (an example that comes to mind is a scripted configurable prompt that was written in DG).

I dunno. Give me an example of the DG code to accomplish that if you would. I've never used DG scripts so I can't really say how more or less difficult it would be in other scripting languages.

Configurable prompt:

Name: 'Configurable Prompt (Attached to Player)'
Trigger Intended Assignment: Mobiles
Trigger Type: Command , Numeric Arg: 100, Arg list: *
if %self% != %actor% 
  halt 
  return 0 
end 
if %cmd% == help 
  set prompt 'prompt 
  if %prompt.contains('%arg%)% && %arg.contains(pr)% 
    %send% %self% Syntax: 
    %send% %self% fprompt <prompt> 
    %send% %self% fprompt default 
    %send% %self% prompt default 
    %send% %self% prompt <prompt>  
    %send% %self% tcolor 
    %send% %self% @n 
    %send% %self% @RImmortal ONLY!:@n  
    %send% %self% @n 
    %send% %self% Prompt default will set your prompt to a default setting, with only the 
    %send% %self% bare minimum of information posted in your prompt. 
    %send% %self% @n 
    %send% %self% Tcolor stands for "toggle color". This will automate percentile coloring 
    %send% %self% for life/mana/move/ and opponent's hp in your fprompt. 
    %send% %self% @n 
    %send% %self% Typing prompt with anything following it other than default will alter your 
    %send% %self% prompt to be whatever follows it. ie. To have <current hp>/<max hp> as your 
    %send% %self% prompt you would type: 'prompt #H/#MH'. 
    %send% %self% @n 
    %send% %self% Valid Fields for the prompt are as follows: 
    %send% %self% @n 
    %send% %self% Prompt Commands are: 
    %send% %self% #H    - current hp 
    %send% %self% #MH   - max hp 
    %send% %self% #MN   - current mana 
    %send% %self% #MM   - max mana 
    %send% %self% #V    - current move 
    %send% %self% #MV   - max move 
    %send% %self% #G    - current gold 
    %send% %self% #EXP  - current experience 
    %send% %self% #S    - room sector 
    %send% %self% #EXIT - displays exits in current room 
    %send% %self% @n 
    %send% %self% #N    - GOD ONLY displays room vnum 
    %send% %self% @n 
    %send% %self% When using the scripted prompt we suggest that you turn off the hard-coded prompt, 
    %send% %self% this can be done by typing 'display' off. 
  else 
    return 0 
  end 
elseif %cmd% == prompt || %cmd% == fprompt 
  if %cmd% == prompt% 
    set revcmd fprompt 
  else 
    set revcmd prompt 
  end 
  if %arg% == default 
    rdelete s%cmd% %self.id% 
    %send% %self% %cmd% set to default. Remember that this does not delete the other 
    %send% %self% your %revcmd%. 
  else 
    if %arg.contains(actor)% || %arg.contains(self)% 
      %teleport% %self% 10 *arbitrary room number, a room with a command script with no script but a * as the arg, 
      *sole intent is to freeze cheaters 
      nop %self.title(I was caught attempting to cheat with the prompt, now I'm being punished.)% 
      halt 
    end 
    set s%cmd% %arg% 
    remote s%cmd% %self.id% 
    %send% %self% %cmd% has been set. 
  end 
elseif %cmd% == tcolor 
  if %self.varexists(tcolor)% 
    rdelete tcolor %self.id% 
    %send% %self% Tcolor is now off. 
  else 
    set tcolor 1 
    remote tcolor %self.id% 
    %send% %self% Tcolor is now on! 
  end 
else 
  return 0 
  wait 1 
  if %self.fighting% 
    set var f 
  end 
  if %self.varexists(s%var%prompt)% 
    eval p %%self.s%var%prompt%% 
  else 
    set p #H/#MH > 
  end 
  set n %p.strlen% 
  set i 1 
  while %i% <= %n% 
    set c %p.charat(%i%)% 
    if !%c% 
      set out @n @n 
    elseif %c% == # 
      set in_var 1 
      unset var 
      while %in_var% 
        eval i %i% + 1 
        set c %p.charat(%i%)% 
        eval 2 %2% + 1 
        switch %c% 
          case # 
            set out %out%# 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
          case H 
            set var %var%H 
          break 
          case P 
            set var %var%P 
          break 
          case M 
            set var %var%M 
          break 
          case V 
            set var %var%V 
          break 
          case G 
            set var %var%G 
          break 
          case E 
            set var %var%E 
          break 
          case X 
            set var %var%X 
          break 
          case I 
            set var %var%I 
          break 
          case T 
            set var %var%T 
          break 
          case S 
            set var %var%S 
          break 
          case N 
            set var %var%N 
          break 
          case O 
            set var %var%O 
          break 
        done 
        switch %var% 
          case H 
            set out %self.hitp% 
            set in_var 0 
            set max %self.maxhitp% 
          break 
          case MH 
            set out %self.maxhitp% 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
          case MN 
            set out %self.mana% 
            set max %self.maxmana% 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
          case MM 
            set out %self.maxmana% 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
          case V 
            set out %self.move% 
            set max %self.maxmove% 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
          case MV 
            set out %self.maxmove% 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
          case G 
            set out %self.gold% 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
          case EXP 
            set out %self.exp% 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
          case S 
            set out %self.room.sector% 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
          case EXIT 
            set exits Exits: 
            set 1 north 
            set 2 east 
            set 3 south 
            set 4 west 
            set 5 up 
            set 6 down 
            set d 1 
            while %d% < 7 
              eval dir %%%d%%% 
              eval check %%self.room.%dir%%% 
              if %check% 
                eval door %%self.room.%dir%(bits)%% /= closed 
                if %door% 
                  set exits %exits% (%dir%) 
                else 
                  set exits %exits% %dir% 
                end 
              end 
              eval d %d% + 1 
            done 
            set out %exits% 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
          case N 
            if %self.level% > 30 
              set out %self.room.vnum% 
            else 
              set out %c% 
            end 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
          case OH 
            if %self.fighting% 
              eval oh ((%self.fighting.hitp% / %self.fighting.maxhitp%) * 100) 
              set out %oh% 
            else 
              set out %c% 
            end 
            set in_var 0 
          break 
        done 
        if %self.varexists(tcolor)% 
          if %max% || %out% == %oh% 
            if %out% == %oh% 
              set per %oh% 
            else 
              eval per ((%out% / %max%) * 100) 
            end 
            unset max 
            if %per% > 90 
              set col @W%out%@n 
            elseif %per% > 70 
              set col @G%out%@n 
            elseif %per% > 40 
              set col @Y%out%@n 
            elseif %per% > 10 
              set col @R%out%@n 
            else 
              set col @D%out%@n 
            end 
            set out %col% 
          end 
        end 
      done 
    else 
      set out %c% 
    end 
    set prmpt %prmpt%%out% 
    eval i %i% + 1 
  done 
  %send% %self% %prmpt% 
end

If you've not seen people using e.g. Lua, how can you be so sure that a builder wouldn't find it easy to use?

Your configurable prompt's syntax, for example, is almost identical to Lua syntax. (Except that IMO it's uglier with all those '%' lying around.)

Agreed. I find all the %'s around everything annoying, and difficult to read as well. While Lua, Ruby, and even Python are much easier to read.

It certainly is more powerful than mprogs. I'm not absolutely sure that it's more simple than other languages. It seems a bit unintuitive even as an experienced developer for some of the syntax.

That being said, it looks pretty powerful for open ended development from builders.

That is quite interesting, but how did you handle players following each other?

Wrote a special ifcheck for the room to check if an exit existed. If it existed, It skipped the rest of the prog.

On the bright side, tintin++ supports both VT100 and character mode, primarily so it works with BBSes and Roguelikes. There's a ROM mud at ar.static.net 4000 with some decent VT100 and character mode features you might want to take a look at.

Too bad tintin++ apparently has issues with displaying extended characters such as etc. One of my builders reported that my title didn't display properly in her tintin++.

[Edit:] Heh. Helps if I include my title.
Nibelungen () Kayle ()