22 May, 2008, Guest wrote in the 1st comment:
Votes: 0
Ok. It seems that I need to clear up some rumors that have been going around because people either are not paying attention or are assuming things I have not said yet. So let's give this a try, shall we?

1. Alsherok is closing forever.

Yes. This is true. I've closed Alsherok to the public forever. I have many reasons for this that go back a good 3-4 years or so. Yes, there was a nasty incident more recently that you might call the proverbial straw. There's more to it than that, and I'm not getting into it all here, but suffice it to say that the current state of the "community" has finally become more than I'm willing to put up with. Nobody played the game anyway, so I fail to see why it's such a big deal.

2. SmaugMuds.org is closing forerver too!

No. This is not true. What is true is that I've handed off the day to day operations to Kayle for the next couple of months. My involvement with the project is not going to be as active as it once was, and may well drop to zero before the end of this year. This isn't some kind of uber-tragedy. These things happen. Once more, the current state of the "community" has brought me to this point.

3. Samson is going to sell MudBytes to someone for a lot of money before leaving.

Really, I don't know where this one came from. But a few of you have not only asked, but made offers. I admit, I find the idea tempting, but the site is not mine to sell and the domain is not on the auction block. It is true that my level of development activity has been pretty low but that's part of the overall state of things and is not an indication that I'm planning to sell anything.

4. AFKMud is going to be shelved for good.

This one is more or less true. I have one last update I want to make to it and then I'm going to upload the results here and at smaugmuds.org and then put an end to any further involvement with the codebase. People will be free to pick it apart for bits and pieces, use the whole thing, use none of it, whatever. But I'm tired of the constant barrage of "it sucks, its bloatware, delete this from it, delete that from it" type of complaints I've received for it. It's not worth the hassle anymore. It just isn't.

5. Samson is leaving IMC.

Could very well be. Lately using it has brought me no pleasure and I've had to institute localized bans against certain individuals because they don't know when to stop picking. That combined with the fact that the general attitude has devolved to that of a facebook chatroom caused me to lose interest awhile back. I haven't really been on there a lot, and I know plenty of you have noticed that. There's a pretty strong chance I'm going to transfer server02 over to the mudbytes box and turn administration of it over to Davion until he can find someone else to take care of it.

6. Samson is leaving mudding because of Cratylus.

I'm sure I'll always have some level of involvement with mudding. Yes, Cratylus was a large part of why I've become so sick of it lately. But he's not the only one and a thread over on TMC was the catalyst for most of what's gone on over the last month in terms of preparing to drop projects. He's not the only problem. If he was it wouldn't have come to this. A lot of people are to blame. A lot of people want to see me gone anyway. A lot of people are damn close to getting their wish. A lot of people have only themselves to blame for driving me out the way they did.

I am generally a very thick skinned person. Yes, I can be quick to anger. I always have been, probably always will be. It's a failing. Apparently one that even now Cratylus continues to try and exploit for whatever sick games he thinks he's playing. His latest round has gone beyond the usual trolling and stick poking. I've had enough of it and will be taking appropriate action should he continue down this path.

7. Arthmoor is going to close.

No. Not true. Not a word of it. Anyone who thinks so is working from bad information. I have no plans to close down Arthmoor. Whoever tells you otherwise is a liar.

8. Samson is going to commit suicide.

Really. I mean. Wow. This one goes well off the deep end if I ever saw it. So basically what I'm to understand is that because I'm closing down some stuff, transferring control of other stuff to other people, and because I'm dropping involvement with most of it I've demonstrated that I'm going to off myself? Seriously, anyone who thinks that is is far more danger than I am because it clearly shows that *THEY* are the ones with no other life outside of MUDs. To think that any of this represents activity of such importance that getting tired of it all means my life is over is simply ludicrous. Anyone thinking along these lines needs their heads examined and fast.

There are plenty of you who know me well enough that you saw this all coming a long time ago. It should come as no surprise. The rest of you, I don't know. Apparently you don't know me at all. If you couldn't see that constantly bullying me for no good reason wouldn't eventually lead to this point there's something wrong with you. Everyone cracks. The fact that it took me this long to crack should be telling you something.

Now please. Stop spreading silly rumors. Stop listening to people who have no idea what's going on. If you want to know something, ask me.
22 May, 2008, David Haley wrote in the 2nd comment:
Votes: 0
Where are all of these rumors spreading?
22 May, 2008, Guest wrote in the 3rd comment:
Votes: 0
People talking amongst themselves I guess, eventually the information gets back to me. It's a very small community after all. Someone forwarded me an email directly from Cratylus though so I know where the suicide rumor came from at least.
22 May, 2008, David Haley wrote in the 4th comment:
Votes: 0
Ah. I hadn't seen anything here, on SmaugMuds, on IMC, or even on TMC (after just a very brief perusal, admittedly) so I wasn't sure where all this talking was happening. Since you made a public announcement about it I was wondering if there was a whole conversation going on somewhere that I was missing. :smile:
22 May, 2008, Guest wrote in the 5th comment:
Votes: 0
There have apparently been plenty going on in places I'm not in, and as I said, the information gets back to me one way or another. So rather than wait for the rampant speculation to spread on its own ( as apparently it already is ) I figured I'd step in front of it this time. From what I'm told Cratylus is already trying to deny his involvement in the last round over on my own blog where I banned him after he wouldn't stop. Despite having obviously confirmed it's his IP since he's now aware of the ban and the only way that's possible is if a banned IP comes back to the site.
22 May, 2008, Midboss wrote in the 6th comment:
Votes: 0
I can't help but wonder exactly how long until the whole hobby dies out. The community has been losing people pretty steadily since even before I disappeared. Good luck to you Samson, wherever you run off to. I think you'll find life without connections to the deteriorating MUD community quite enjoyable, I know I have.
23 May, 2008, Zenn wrote in the 7th comment:
Votes: 0
It saddens me that we're losing a good deal of the older folks that know what the hell they're doing. I've noticed that the SMAUG derivatives haven't been updated much lately.. It seems SWR and FotE updates have completely ceased. I haven't seen anything new in the SWR community itself in a long, long time because people are hoarding code.

As for SMAUG? I don't pay too much attention to it, but the last (FUSS) update was about a year ago.
23 May, 2008, Guest wrote in the 8th comment:
Votes: 0
Midboss said:
I can't help but wonder exactly how long until the whole hobby dies out. The community has been losing people pretty steadily since even before I disappeared. Good luck to you Samson, wherever you run off to. I think you'll find life without connections to the deteriorating MUD community quite enjoyable, I know I have.


Honestly, I have no idea. It's been dying a slow death now for at least 3 years or so. I've noticed the same disappearance of may of the "old school" types from the scene. They either pack up and leave entirely, or retreat into their private niches.

As far as where I've run off to, I've been spending time in the Oblivion modding community and I have to say your observation is spot on. I'm enjoying myself quite a bit doing that. It actually started off normally enough. I just wanted to fix some bugs in one of the mods I use. Ended up taking over the project entirely with the previous author's blessing. When's the last time you heard of that happening with a MUD? :)

Zenn said:
It saddens me that we're losing a good deal of the older folks that know what the hell they're doing. I've noticed that the SMAUG derivatives haven't been updated much lately.. It seems SWR and FotE updates have completely ceased. I haven't seen anything new in the SWR community itself in a long, long time because people are hoarding code.

As for SMAUG? I don't pay too much attention to it, but the last (FUSS) update was about a year ago.


Indeed. The SWR derivative bases have all but died. Keberus is trying to keep things alive but it seems most of the SWR folks have all gone underground already. I can't recall having seen anything new out of them myself in a long time. Other than the occasional bugfix that makes its way to the FUSS site.

As for FUSS itself, there was just an update last night for some bugs in the new weather system. The project itself hasn't died, it's just my own involvement I'm trying to scale back on.
23 May, 2008, David Haley wrote in the 9th comment:
Votes: 0
(EDIT: Samson posted while I was writing, so this is in reply to Zenn, not Samson.)

Well, it's not entirely surprising, is it? A lot of people are moving on to greener pastures, either in terms of audience or in terms of money. A lot of people graduate from college and get jobs, losing their spare time. MUDs have much smaller audiences so there is less incentive to build one. Coding is hard and somebody who knows what they're doing might want to spend that time doing something that will be more valuable.

In my personal case, MUDs are a very good testbed/playground for programming techniques. It's a nice place to play with scripting languages, for example, because the gain is obvious and quickly visible. It's also a fun place to play with AI programming: you don't need to draw any animations/graphics that go with the AI behavior, you can just describe it. In general, by only having to describe but not draw what is happening, you cut down the work load immensely.

I'm not entirely sure why the community is the way it is. I disagree with the overly negative views of the community; I think some of it is due to bitterness built up over time not towards the community as a whole but really just a few individuals. I think the real problem is the stagnation of the people involved: the general trend is toward losing people, not gaining them. Stagnation is never good for communities; fresh blood is important. But one of the problems is that a lot of the fresh blood in MUD communities tends to be people who are not very experienced programmers to begin with, and so quite a while must pass before they become a strong contributing member. This is not a problem when you have larger communities, but when you lose established members faster than you gain new established people it becomes a big issue.

Really, though, I think that the important thing to remember is that this is a hobby and that it's not necessary to get all worked up about it. People have been getting pretty personal lately and I'm just not sure that is necessary or healthy.
23 May, 2008, Mabus wrote in the 10th comment:
Votes: 0
Thank you for what you did do for the community, Samson.

Best of luck where ever you find yourself.
23 May, 2008, Asylumius wrote in the 11th comment:
Votes: 0
There are still a lot of thriving MUDs out there, both free ones and the commercialized projects like we see from Iron Realms. The MUD I play still needs peaks of about 80 players, and I know there are quite a few MUDs out there that see pretty good numbers as well. Many of them simply don't participate heavy (or all all) in communities like TMC, TMS, etc. A lot of MUDs, for the most part, rely on word of mouth and their players to spread their games, being part of such a tiny niche.

What I do think we're seeing a massive decline in is development. Like I said, there are a lot of MUDs out there, they're just closed-source projects that operate for their own playerbase and not for a community of coders. Although there is still some lingering activity in a few circles, most of the popular branches of DIKU have died off. We don't see new, significant releases of pretty much anything these days. Likewise, we're not seeing nearly as much discussion about MUD design, programming, etc.

Why? Maybe because those active in the community are growing up and moving on and the WOW generation isn't replacing them. Maybe because we alienate the shit out of each other. Maybe I don't know.

Like David said, it's a hobby. The creation of most of the popular codebases is the product of genuine interest and fascination with the subject. It's entirely possible that that interest simply doesn't exist anymore, or as strongly, in as many people.

The community as we know it may very well be dying, but that's not a bad thing. Just like a dozen other trends that have "dried up", there will always be people passionate enough to continue working on their own projects, and people interested in playing them. At the very worst, MUDing will simply become an obscurer niche.
23 May, 2008, Zenn wrote in the 12th comment:
Votes: 0
Asylumius said:
The community as we know it may very well be dying, but that's not a bad thing.


I respectfully disagree.

I like the community as we know it :sad:
23 May, 2008, Asylumius wrote in the 13th comment:
Votes: 0
Zenn said:
Asylumius said:
The community as we know it may very well be dying, but that's not a bad thing.


I respectfully disagree.

I like the community as we know it :sad:


That's sort of my point, I guess. Anybody who really cares will still be here in a year, or five, or ten, or whatever. Losing interest or moving on isn't a bad thing. There will be people interested in MUDs and MUD development for a long time, even if it's a smaller group of people, or different people.

IMHO, what we have is a case of a bunch of folks who are afraid that the "good old days" are, or will soon be, gone forever. On the plus side, we can all start telling stories that begin with, "In my day…" now.
23 May, 2008, David Haley wrote in the 14th comment:
Votes: 0
I think that we have long since entered the old fogey stage, it just took a while to realize it. :tongue:
23 May, 2008, Tommi wrote in the 15th comment:
Votes: 0
Quote
Why? Maybe because those active in the community are growing up and moving on


Not necessarily, the trouble as i see it, is those older vocal and visible members of the community have spent to much energy on protecting their own self interest and positions that they have not taken the time to mentor or foster new blood into more respectful roles and anyone who shows any real interest or promise is usually gets alienated from the outset. The big 2 names in mud websites TMC and MM are in many ways controlled by 3 or 4 names and anyone who disagrees with them is shut out, and in the MM case modded down.

There is little in the way of openness, there is no collaboration, way too much suspicion, projects act like they are competitors of each other, and i too have closed up source and not released 3 possible releases of eldhamud due to being accused of being a code thief. The only real way to community is through openness, collaboration and sharing between projects.

@Samson, for what its worth, your only real fault is not being able to admit when your wrong, i wish you the best of luck in whatever you put your energy into, to grow we need change, new directions and challenges and i hope you find those things to revitalize your spirit and enjoyment of what is essentially a hobby.
23 May, 2008, Tommi wrote in the 16th comment:
Votes: 0
Quote
I think that we have long since entered the old fogey stage, it just took a while to realize it.


Only parts of it have, there are still some areas of the general mud world that are thriving and vibrant. Those with the time, talent and inclination can still carve for themselves a successful project that is enjoyed and played by many, and some even have the vision to try and recruit players and staff from outside the mudding world. There needs to be a new general vision for the mud world, but like most major advances in society there needs to be great catastrophe, we just have not reached the point where we tip over.
23 May, 2008, David Haley wrote in the 17th comment:
Votes: 0
I think it's a little unfair to lay the blame on the old guard for not being willing to share their work and mentor new people. This forum, SmaugMuds and Gammon's are all about helping people with their coding problems. This forum doesn't see much of it, but since the crowd is mostly the same, people tend to get help when they ask for it.

It's true that a lot of people aren't publishing their code bases, but frankly I do not think that is some holy grail that would somehow revitalize the community. Some work has been done on the fringes that has been for the most part completely ignored by the people in this community (myself included to some extent). It suffices to see how much resistance there is to changing things too much. For better or for worse, that hinders bold new development that can push things forward.

Tommi said:
Only parts of it have, there are still some areas of the general mud world that are thriving and vibrant.

By "old fogey" I didn't mean that things aren't happening, it just means that we've already been speaking about the good old days of times past for a while now.
23 May, 2008, Tommi wrote in the 18th comment:
Votes: 0
Quote
This forum, SmaugMuds and Gammon's are all about helping people


Oh i agree with you 100%, whenever i have a code issue www.gammon.com.au is the only place that i ask. The reasons why are simple, the attitude there is one of teaching and guiding people through the problem and helping them understand in detail. Also from experience, i have never been made to feel foolish or stupid in any question i have posed. For that reason alone i do not frequent mud magic .

Quote
It's true that a lot of people aren't publishing their code bases,


Openness does not have to mean published bases, there are a great many ways to acheive those same goals without ever releasing your code. Kavir is one example of someone who is open to sharing about his ideas and the reasons behind design decisions he has made, in many ways GW2 is extremely open yet the code is closed. Rather than share, we end up in eternal debates about the stupid Diku license, medieva or some other pointless discussion.
23 May, 2008, Fizban wrote in the 19th comment:
Votes: 0
Quote
Openness does not have to mean published bases, there are a great many ways to acheive those same goals without ever releasing your code. Kavir is one example of someone who is open to sharing about his ideas and the reasons behind design decisions he has made, in many ways GW2 is extremely open yet the code is closed.


And I doubt anyone can blame him for not opening Godwars II's code to the public after the in numerous number of code theft incidents that have taken place with muds running derivatives of the original GodWars.
0.0/19