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<H1>Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</H1>
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<LI><em>To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#null,net">mud-dev#null,net</A></LI>
<LI><em>Subject</em>: Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</LI>
<LI><em>From</em>: Matt Chatterley <<A HREF="mailto:root#mpc,dyn.ml.org">root#mpc,dyn.ml.org</A>></LI>
<LI><em>Date</em>: Tue, 5 Aug 1997 07:38:11 +0000 (GMT)</LI>
<LI><em>Reply-To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:neddy#itl,net">neddy#itl,net</A></LI>
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<PRE>
On Mon, 4 Aug 1997, Marian Griffith wrote:
> On Sun 03 Aug, Matt Chatterley wrote:
> > On Sun, 3 Aug 1997, Marian Griffith wrote:
> > I'd protest that alchemy (from a more scientific point of view, leaving
> > the mystical elements aside temporarily) is primitive "chemistry", and the
> > basic ways things interact are going to be same. This is the approach I'm
> > basing my system on, and allowing the mystical side as 'modifiers' to what
> > things do.
>
> I think we agree on this point then :)
I hope so. :P
> I was just wondering when half the time people look like they are discus-
> sing alchemy when I think they're talking about chemistry. Not that I can
> reliably distinguish the one from the other. But that's mainly because it
> is all magic to me.
Heh, thats an interesting thought. Well, this is the approach I take to a
lot of magic; The world was designed (by its creator, who is actually
still alive, and involved in a 'high level' quest) in such a way that it
was to be non-magical (nothing originally relied upon magic to work).
However, gradually magic started to seep in through a dimensional leak
(which it is not possible to stop, although it can be controlled to a
degree).
The net effect of this is that many things are 'logical' or 'natural' with
a magical overlay, this alchemy example being a case in point.
> > To give a pair of quick examples:
>
> > You could have a herbalist of some description who mixes a few ground up
> > roots with some water, to produce a rather non-magical, but quite effect-
> > ive treatment to help stop severe wounds bleeding.
>
> > You could also have a different character, who mixes similar herbs with
> > water, and enchants them to produce a very different poultice, which has
> > a similar but more dramatic effect - it doesn't help to stop bleeding, it
> > burns the wound clean, sealing it into a scar within seconds.
>
> Well yes. that's more or less what I was thinking too. Maybe even go so far
> as having the alchemist being capable to create potions, poultices and so on
> that wouldn't work for the herbalist. While the herbalist has the advantage
> that her mixtures are simpler to obtain and more reliable.
Yup. The more magic you apply to something in any state, the more you can
change it (and the more it changes you!), but it also becomes unrealiable.
To a degree, anything which uses magic is a magipacitor (hah! Magical
capacitor!), and those of us with some electronics background know what
happens if you put a huge current and/or voltage through an electrolytic
capacitor, and repeatedly reverse the connections.. *pop*
> > I read the post you sent, but didn't actually reply, because I
> > don't have much to add. :)
>
> *smile* I guess it was not so much a post meant to start discussion. It is
> more of a "this is what I think of when people talk about alchemy" type of
> post.
I read it, thought 'blimey', decided not to even try replying, and deleted
it. ;) Party because I do a mail-read at 7am, and most of the mud-dev
shows up then; I like to reply to it all before I go to work.
> > I'm moving onto considering the actual user interface, and how to handle
> > things like the second example above, now.
>
> I still believe that the best way to get at that is to have a system of
> beliefs (laws of magic if you want) that tells -why- something actually
> works. Alchemists came up with a variety of theories that may not have
> been particularly scientific but they did explain things. To an extent.
> The advantage of having your own game is that you can make certain that
> a theory actually works. Then, if you never tell the players why magic
> works, you end up with a mystical art of alchemy that players can theo-
> rise about and teach their apprentices.
Yup. I'm looking at two levels of 'rules'. The first level is the basic
chemical stuff - whereby adding the right amount of X to the right amount
of Y produces an appropriate concentration of Z.
The second layer is the 'mystical' layer, whereby preparing X in a certain
way (perhaps with silver instruments), and Y in a certain way (perhaps
with gold instruments), then mixing them in roughly appropriate
quantities, in a special vessel (copper cauldron), produces the potential
for enchantment of the product.
> Marian
> --
> Yes - at last - You. I Choose you. Out of all the world,
> out of all the seeking, I have found you, young sister of
> my heart! You are mine and I am yours - and never again
> will there be loneliness ...
>
> Rolan Choosing Talia,
> Arrows of the Queen, by Mercedes Lackey
>
>
>
>
Regards,
-Matt Chatterley
<A HREF="http://user.itl.net/~neddy/index.html">http://user.itl.net/~neddy/index.html</A>
"Speak softly and carry a big stick." -Theodore Roosevelt
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<LI><STRONG><A NAME="00383" HREF="msg00383.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</A></STRONG>
<UL><LI><EM>From:</EM> Marian Griffith <gryphon#iaehv,nl></LI></UL></LI>
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<ul><li>Thread context:
<BLOCKQUOTE><UL>
<LI><STRONG>Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</STRONG>, <EM>(continued)</EM>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00350" HREF="msg00350.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</A></strong>,
Matt Chatterley <a href="mailto:root#mpc,dyn.ml.org">root#mpc,dyn.ml.org</a>, Sun 03 Aug 1997, 15:36 GMT
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00359" HREF="msg00359.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</A></strong>,
Marian Griffith <a href="mailto:gryphon#iaehv,nl">gryphon#iaehv,nl</a>, Mon 04 Aug 1997, 04:33 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00360" HREF="msg00360.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</A></strong>,
Matt Chatterley <a href="mailto:root#mpc,dyn.ml.org">root#mpc,dyn.ml.org</a>, Mon 04 Aug 1997, 05:06 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00383" HREF="msg00383.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</A></strong>,
Marian Griffith <a href="mailto:gryphon#iaehv,nl">gryphon#iaehv,nl</a>, Tue 05 Aug 1997, 03:36 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00388" HREF="msg00388.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</A></strong>,
Matt Chatterley <a href="mailto:root#mpc,dyn.ml.org">root#mpc,dyn.ml.org</a>, Tue 05 Aug 1997, 13:40 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
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</UL>
</LI>
</UL>
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</ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00478" HREF="msg00478.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</A></strong>,
clawrenc <a href="mailto:clawrenc#cup,hp.com">clawrenc#cup,hp.com</a>, Tue 12 Aug 1997, 00:00 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00486" HREF="msg00486.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</A></strong>,
Matt Chatterley <a href="mailto:root#mpc,dyn.ml.org">root#mpc,dyn.ml.org</a>, Tue 12 Aug 1997, 06:19 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00564" HREF="msg00564.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</A></strong>,
clawrenc <a href="mailto:clawrenc#cup,hp.com">clawrenc#cup,hp.com</a>, Thu 14 Aug 1997, 20:43 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
</ul>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00336" HREF="msg00336.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Virtual Chemistry</A></strong>,
Marian Griffith <a href="mailto:gryphon#iaehv,nl">gryphon#iaehv,nl</a>, Sat 02 Aug 1997, 19:12 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
</ul>
</LI>
</UL></BLOCKQUOTE>
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