<!-- MHonArc v2.4.4 -->
<!--X-Subject: Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list -->
<!--X-From-R13: fvybivpNfepr.ue ([vebfyni Evybivp) -->
<!--X-Date: from babe.globecomm.net [207.51.48.8] by in3.ibm.net id 864338061.86908-2 Thu May 22 21:54:21 1997 CUT -->
<!--X-Message-Id: 199705222107.XAA08208#regoc,srce.hr -->
<!--X-Content-Type: text/plain -->
<!--X-Reference: 199705212349.QAA08810#xsvr3,cup.hp.com -->
<!--X-Head-End-->
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
<html>
<head>
<title>MUD-Dev message, Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</title>
<!-- meta name="robots" content="noindex,nofollow" -->
<link rev="made" href="mailto:silovic#srce,hr">
</head>
<body background="/backgrounds/paperback.gif" bgcolor="#ffffff"
text="#000000" link="#0000FF" alink="#FF0000" vlink="#006000">
<font size="+4" color="#804040">
<strong><em>MUD-Dev<br>mailing list archive</em></strong>
</font>
<br>
[ <a href="../">Other Periods</a>
| <a href="../../">Other mailing lists</a>
| <a href="/search.php3">Search</a>
]
<br clear=all><hr>
<!--X-Body-Begin-->
<!--X-User-Header-->
<!--X-User-Header-End-->
<!--X-TopPNI-->
Date:
[ <a href="msg00698.html">Previous</a>
| <a href="msg00700.html">Next</a>
]
Thread:
[ <a href="msg00754.html">Previous</a>
| <a href="msg00657.html">Next</a>
]
Index:
[ <A HREF="author.html#00699">Author</A>
| <A HREF="#00699">Date</A>
| <A HREF="thread.html#00699">Thread</A>
]
<!--X-TopPNI-End-->
<!--X-MsgBody-->
<!--X-Subject-Header-Begin-->
<H1>Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</H1>
<HR>
<!--X-Subject-Header-End-->
<!--X-Head-of-Message-->
<UL>
<LI><em>To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#null,net">mud-dev#null,net</A></LI>
<LI><em>Subject</em>: Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</LI>
<LI><em>From</em>: <A HREF="mailto:silovic#srce,hr">silovic#srce,hr</A> (Miroslav Silovic)</LI>
<LI><em>Date</em>: Thu, 22 May 1997 23:07:04 +0200 (MET DST)</LI>
</UL>
<!--X-Head-of-Message-End-->
<!--X-Head-Body-Sep-Begin-->
<HR>
<!--X-Head-Body-Sep-End-->
<!--X-Body-of-Message-->
<PRE>
> In <<A HREF="msg00656.html">199705210941.LAA00172#regoc,srce.hr</A>>, on 05/21/97
> at 08:27 AM, silovic#srce,hr (Miroslav Silovic) said:
>
> >> In <<A HREF="msg00575.html">199705190115.DAA06158#regoc,srce.hr</A>>, on 05/18/97
> >> at 06:19 PM, silovic#srce,hr (Miroslav Silovic) said:
>
> >> Tho I haven't cleaned up the details, the presentation I have in mind
> >> is very much that the shared reality experienced in the MUD is a
> >> physical construct resulting purely from the mutual mental actions of
> >> the players. Probably this will be presented in much the manner of
> >> (all) the players being once near-omnipitent (demi-)gods who were
> >> mutually responsible for the initial creation of the universe, but are
> >> now much descended from their former stature and power and
> >> concomittantly bereft of much of their memory.
> >>
> >> See! User-programming is perfectly in character.
>
> >I don't see it: If I were god, I'd change the world by something that
> >starts with 'let there be *', not by something that starts with
> >@create blah. :)
>
> I don't see this. Were I a god, I would expect to be bound by
> strictures that don't apply to me as a mortal. Consider the handling
> of side effects:
>
> Uhh, let there be light!
>
> Okay, we have uniform non-directional source-less light. The
> world just *glows*.
> <vaguelly amusing variations deleted>
> It becomes rather similar to the recent ambiguity debates. I see this
> as a variant upon programming with programming merely being a semantic
> form which allows precise and formalised description of a desired
> behaviour (as well as the debugging as above).
You misunderstood me completely. It should go something like this:
> tell bigshot_admin I want to create light
Bigshot admin tells you "Okay. You can. Now code it."
> codecodecode
> tell bigshot_admin Done.
Bigshot admin tells you Jussec...
Bigshot admin tells you Okay, looks like light to me.
Read also my other response in the same thread.
<snip>
> >I can tell
> >you that the experince is very hard to describe to somebody who never
> >played a high-impact scene. With practice, you learn to build a
> >'sub-persona' in your mind, and shift gears to it while playing him
> >or her (this is what I do and what most RPers I know do). Splitting
> >one's mind and then watching over your character's shoulder is the
> >most important source of fun for both RPers and actors. But in your
> >view of MUDding, this never happens.
>
> Yup. It is something I can appreciate, doubt I would enjoy, and am
> uncertain if I wish to enourage or explicitly support in my games (has
> little relevance to my interests or sense of importances). Jaime's
> recent post discussing having the game presenting a possible choice to
> the player (do you succeed or fail at climbing the cliff) illuminates
> this well. Such a question or decision requested by a game system is
> inherently antithetical to my concept of how a desirable game system
> works to an extent that I doubt they can be reconciled.
Well, I have to agree that we disagree here. I enjoy both types of
the game. However, I judiciously apply the term RP only on the game
that evoke the feeling above.
Miro
</PRE>
<!--X-Body-of-Message-End-->
<!--X-MsgBody-End-->
<!--X-Follow-Ups-->
<HR>
<!--X-Follow-Ups-End-->
<!--X-References-->
<UL><LI><STRONG>References</STRONG>:
<UL>
<LI><STRONG><A NAME="00688" HREF="msg00688.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></STRONG>
<UL><LI><EM>From:</EM> clawrenc#cup,hp.com</LI></UL></LI>
</UL></LI></UL>
<!--X-References-End-->
<!--X-BotPNI-->
<UL>
<LI>Prev by Date:
<STRONG><A HREF="msg00698.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Languages</A></STRONG>
</LI>
<LI>Next by Date:
<STRONG><A HREF="msg00700.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></STRONG>
</LI>
<LI>Prev by thread:
<STRONG><A HREF="msg00754.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></STRONG>
</LI>
<LI>Next by thread:
<STRONG><A HREF="msg00657.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></STRONG>
</LI>
<LI>Index(es):
<UL>
<LI><A HREF="index.html#00699"><STRONG>Date</STRONG></A></LI>
<LI><A HREF="thread.html#00699"><STRONG>Thread</STRONG></A></LI>
</UL>
</LI>
</UL>
<!--X-BotPNI-End-->
<!--X-User-Footer-->
<!--X-User-Footer-End-->
<ul><li>Thread context:
<BLOCKQUOTE><UL>
<LI><STRONG>Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</STRONG>, <EM>(continued)</EM>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00697" HREF="msg00697.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>,
Caliban Tiresias Darklock <a href="mailto:caliban#darklock,com">caliban#darklock,com</a>, Fri 23 May 1997, 03:59 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00726" HREF="msg00726.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>,
clawrenc <a href="mailto:clawrenc#cup,hp.com">clawrenc#cup,hp.com</a>, Sat 24 May 1997, 07:38 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00740" HREF="msg00740.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>,
Caliban Tiresias Darklock <a href="mailto:caliban#darklock,com">caliban#darklock,com</a>, Sun 25 May 1997, 03:38 GMT
<LI><strong><A NAME="00754" HREF="msg00754.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>,
coder <a href="mailto:coder#ibm,net">coder#ibm,net</a>, Sun 25 May 1997, 07:21 GMT
</LI>
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00699" HREF="msg00699.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>,
Miroslav Silovic <a href="mailto:silovic#srce,hr">silovic#srce,hr</a>, Fri 23 May 1997, 04:54 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
</ul>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00657" HREF="msg00657.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>,
Ling <a href="mailto:K.L.Lo-94#student,lut.ac.uk">K.L.Lo-94#student,lut.ac.uk</a>, Wed 21 May 1997, 19:29 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
</ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00164" HREF="msg00164.html">Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>,
Nathan Yospe <a href="mailto:yospe#hawaii,edu">yospe#hawaii,edu</a>, Sun 20 Apr 1997, 05:15 GMT
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00165" HREF="msg00165.html">Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>,
Nathan Yospe <a href="mailto:yospe#hawaii,edu">yospe#hawaii,edu</a>, Sun 20 Apr 1997, 05:41 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00209" HREF="msg00209.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>,
clawrenc <a href="mailto:clawrenc#cup,hp.com">clawrenc#cup,hp.com</a>, Fri 25 Apr 1997, 11:56 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
</ul>
</LI>
</UL></BLOCKQUOTE>
</ul>
<hr>
<center>
[ <a href="../">Other Periods</a>
| <a href="../../">Other mailing lists</a>
| <a href="/search.php3">Search</a>
]
</center>
<hr>
</body>
</html>