13 Feb, 2011, Deimos wrote in the 21st comment:
Votes: 0
I tried out several Android-based phones before settling on the Droid X. The excellent 4.3 inch display makes typing on the virtual keyboard painless. I could see using an iPhone 4 for a lot of things, but MUDding isn't one of them (or anything requiring a lot of typing, actually). The screen is just too small for my tastes.

And I use BlowTorch, personally. I really like the onscreen buttons, which I've gotten so used to that it's almost annoying having to type out commands on my PC now. :lol:
15 Feb, 2011, plamzi wrote in the 22nd comment:
Votes: 0
Deimos said:
I tried out several Android-based phones before settling on the Droid X. The excellent 4.3 inch display makes typing on the virtual keyboard painless. I could see using an iPhone 4 for a lot of things, but MUDding isn't one of them (or anything requiring a lot of typing, actually). The screen is just too small for my tastes.

And I use BlowTorch, personally. I really like the onscreen buttons, which I've gotten so used to that it's almost annoying having to type out commands on my PC now. :lol:


By your own words, you tried only Android-based phones so I'm not sure your opinion on iPhone4 carries any weight. I looked at specs for the Droid X and it looks like its screen is only 0.3" wider, although significantly taller. Because width is mostly what counts for virtual keyboard size, it doesn't look like the difference in the mudding experience between the two phones would be earth-shattering.

Maybe because I'm not prejudiced against brands and OS's, I have had no trouble mudding on iPhone 3G and iPhone4 and will probably get an iPad next, even though it looks like the amazing retina screen won't come with the next gen.

I do agree with you that the mobile medium is a matter of getting used to a different way of doing things. If someone's coming from 10+ years of desktop use, I can see why mudding on a cellphone would appear to them to be a huge PITA. But it's not.
15 Feb, 2011, David Haley wrote in the 23rd comment:
Votes: 0
I think accusations of prejudice are a little unwarranted, no? You're saying his opinion carries no weight because he's only tried one side of things, but then you say you haven't tried his side but are rejecting it anyhow. :smile:
15 Feb, 2011, plamzi wrote in the 24th comment:
Votes: 0
David Haley said:
I think accusations of prejudice are a little unwarranted, no? You're saying his opinion carries no weight because he's only tried one side of things, but then you say you haven't tried his side but are rejecting it anyhow. :smile:


I think accusations of accusations are a little unwarranted. It's true that I sense prejudice in expressing strong opinions about iPhone4 without having tried it. I think most people would. But I didn't reject Droid X as a viable alternative – I merely observed that based on specs I read it doesn't *look* like the virtual keyboard would be significantly bigger in a way that would make much of a difference. Hardly a rejection. In fact, even if there's absolutely no difference, that in my book is a recommendation for the Droid X because I find iPhone4 typing to be pretty easy, and it's only getting easier with use.

Let's not create drama where there is none.
15 Feb, 2011, David Haley wrote in the 25th comment:
Votes: 0
Yes, let's not create any drama. :smile: But let's also recognize that things we write can very strongly imply accusations even if one is not making them directly, especially if one later says that one was in fact observing prejudice. But then, let's all recognize that we can still be happy and friendly. :smile:
15 Feb, 2011, plamzi wrote in the 26th comment:
Votes: 0
David Haley said:
Yes, let's not create any drama. :smile: But let's also recognize that things we write can very strongly imply accusations even if one is not making them directly, especially if one later says that one was in fact observing prejudice. But then, let's all recognize that we can still be happy and friendly. :smile:


I'm absolutely aware of what all I implied and stand by it. Maybe we should let Deimos respond to that? Also, just to be extra-clear, my comments addressed the *difference* in typing experiences between Droid X and iPhone4 and how it didn't seem earth-shattering for reasons I've shared. So, David, I thought your accusing me of "rejection" was unwarranted.

Even if there are indeed rejections and accusations flying around, I think those are perfectly fine if they move the topic forward. And if they do, they require no exegesis.
15 Feb, 2011, Runter wrote in the 27th comment:
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I have two comments. I haven't tried iphone4 or android. They're both bad.
15 Feb, 2011, David Haley wrote in the 28th comment:
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Well, if you insist, I thought it was weird that you criticized a comment based on lack of experience, and then made a comment of your own based on a similar lack of experience. If his lack of experience is a problem, why isn't yours? It's not a big deal, and I'm sensing some level of unexpected defensiveness here.

It so happens that I think a third of an inch makes quite a difference. I cannot stand typing on iPhones or even iPads – and yes, I've tried – and typing on the Droid X is quite easy for me. It also happens that I find it easier than on the smaller screens of other Android devices. Does that count as topic-moving discussion without unnecessary exegesis? (Allow me to be perfectly honest, though: your sarcasm is just a little unnecessary here and not conducive to reducing drama. :sad: )
15 Feb, 2011, Runter wrote in the 29th comment:
Votes: 0
I like virtual keyboards if they're touch + pressure sensitive. I don't like pure touch type virtual keyboards.
15 Feb, 2011, plamzi wrote in the 30th comment:
Votes: 0
David Haley said:
It so happens that I think a third of an inch makes quite a difference. I cannot stand typing on iPhones or even iPads – and yes, I've tried – and typing on the Droid X is quite easy for me. It also happens that I find it easier than on the smaller screens of other Android devices. Does that count as topic-moving discussion without unnecessary exegesis?


Any experience you share that's pertinent to the topic does indeed count.

If 0.3" makes quite a difference for you, can you tell us more about why you *cannot stand* typing on an iPad, whose keyboard is almost 5" wider (in portrait orientation) than the Droid X?
15 Feb, 2011, jurdendurden wrote in the 31st comment:
Votes: 0
Runter said:
Phone-mudding just sounds like a terrible idea if the game involves a lot of typing.


Agreed. If you run an RP mud… It's just not gonna happen with a bunch of phone mudders.
15 Feb, 2011, David Haley wrote in the 32nd comment:
Votes: 0
I find iDevice keyboard correction to be rather annoying. It doesn't do what I want. But that could admittedly be habit. However, the Android keyboard is the same, basically, on the larger and smaller devices. And with that in mind, the third of an inch makes a big difference. That comparison is far more relevant to me because it is actually apples to apples. It's hard to compare the effect of screen size when one throws in completely different keyboard interfaces. But, with basically identical keyboards, you can actually tell the difference when it comes to screen size.
15 Feb, 2011, KaVir wrote in the 33rd comment:
Votes: 0
plamzi said:
Maybe you just need some time to get used to typing on your new phone. I've seen people who can text as fast as I can type on a desktop keyboard…

Well, one week later, and you're right - I'm finding it quite a lot easier to type. I doubt I'll ever come close to the speed I can reach on a desktop or laptop keyboard, but I'm definitely faster than I was.

plamzi said:
I'm sure Android devices are going to get better and better. But, if you can borrow an iPhone4 for a few min. and fire up any of the free MUD apps out there, you'll see what difference the retina screen makes. It's pretty astonishing.

I'm actually fine with the display on my Android, I've no problem reading it at all, it's only the typing that I find awkward. That's not to say a higher resolution wouldn't be nice, just that (at least for mudding) its the input that causes me trouble.

As I mentioned before, I also own an iPod Touch, which has the same hardware platform and OS as the iPhone. Is it any easier to type on the iPhone4?

plamzi said:
Maybe because I'm not prejudiced against brands and OS's, I have had no trouble mudding on iPhone 3G and iPhone4 and will probably get an iPad next, even though it looks like the amazing retina screen won't come with the next gen.

You've developed two iPhone clients, so I think it might be fair to say you have some degree of brand preference :P

I'll try and find a free iPhone client so that I can compare it with using BlowTorch on the Android. My gut feeling (based on using my iPod for other applications) is that there won't be much difference, but I'd rather test it before making a judgement.

In terms of output, the screen resolution of my Desire HD is approximately half way between the iPhone3 and the iPhone4, so comparing the display of my phone with that of my iPod should also give me a rough idea of how my phone would compare with the iPhone4.
15 Feb, 2011, plamzi wrote in the 34th comment:
Votes: 0
David Haley said:
I find iDevice keyboard correction to be rather annoying. It doesn't do what I want.


iOS autocorrection can't be made to do what you want (can Android's??), but it can definitely be turned off (incidentally, that's all I want from an autocorrection system :grinning:).

David Haley said:
But that could admittedly be habit. However, the Android keyboard is the same, basically, on the larger and smaller devices.


There's nothing wrong with saying that you've used Android for a while and grown accustomed to it. Having the same keyboard on several different form factors is a plus–but only for those who are accustomed to Android already. If you're accustomed to one OS, switching can be unappealing. However, that has nothing to do with iOS and iDevices, and everything to do with your prior experience and desire to avoid another learning curve. This viewpoint may or may not be shared by others, so in writing reviews it's best to disclose it, or you may be accused of prejudice.

David Haley said:
And with that in mind, the third of an inch makes a big difference. That comparison is far more relevant to me because it is actually apples to apples. It's hard to compare the effect of screen size when one throws in completely different keyboard interfaces. But, with basically identical keyboards, you can actually tell the difference when it comes to screen size.


From what I understand, you're comparing Droid X to earlier Android devices with smaller screens but similar keyboard interfaces? If that's the case, then again I don't see a clear argument against iDevices.

As someone who has used both iDevices and Android, and who possesses a considerable command of English, I think you can do a better job of explaining why you cannot stand typing on an iPad vs. a Droid X.


KaVir said:
You've developed two iPhone clients, so I think it might be fair to say you have some degree of brand preference :P


The fact of what I've developed is in my signature, so it's being auto-disclosed with every post I make. But I don't believe that automatically makes me prejudiced. I have many issues with Apple as a company and many specific qualms about their OS and SDK, which I've already shared in other threads. That said, I try to criticize only what I know and feel obligated to raise a hand when something is being talked down without ever given a fair shake, especially if the goal is to help others decide.

Also, in the interest of full full disclosure, when it comes to gadgets, I'm an omnivore. The only reason I haven't tried Android yet is because I haven't found an excuse to blow the money. But any moment now… And I've never been afraid of learning curves on new UI's, etc. so I'm sure I'll find plenty to like when I get my first Google toy.

KaVir said:
As I mentioned before, I also own an iPod Touch, which has the same hardware platform and OS as the iPhone. Is it any easier to type on the iPhone4?


Not easier, I don't think. If your iPod is older gen, then the 4 will feel a tad more responsive, but that's about it in terms of input.

I think if one of your primary uses for a phone is to mud comfortably, the availability of good clients is as important as the device itself. It looks like Blowfish is more than capable and has some good ways to automate input.

While I agree with Runter that RPI MUDs will be more of a challenge to play, I think mobile mudding is going to supplement desktop mudding more and more in the next few years, and RPI MUDs will also see their share of mobile users. The human brain and hand-to-eye coordination are one of those not-to-be-underestimated kinds of things in the Universe.
15 Feb, 2011, David Haley wrote in the 35th comment:
Votes: 0
plamzi said:
However, that has nothing to do with iOS and iDevices

I didn't say it did.

plamzi said:
From what I understand, you're comparing Droid X to earlier Android devices with smaller screens but similar keyboard interfaces? If that's the case, then again I don't see a clear argument against iDevices.

You shouldn't see one. I think you might be interjecting your own viewpoint and – dare I say it? – prejudice and defensiveness here; this has never been a criticism of iDevices (other than the purely personal statement that I don't like their keyboards). I was talking purely to the difference in screen size for an apples-to-apples comparison.

plamzi said:
As someone who has used both iDevices and Android, and who possesses a considerable command of English, I think you can do a better job of explaining why you cannot stand typing on an iPad vs. a Droid X.

Why? Does it matter? I don't like it, it doesn't behave the way I want or expect. I have not tried to say it's inferior nor have I tried to portray it as anything other than personal preference; you seem to have inferred that I was attacking iDevices. I am interested in the apples-to-apples comparison of similar keyboard interfaces but with different screen sizes. I am not interested in discussing my personal preferences other than stating them once briefly; I don't see why other people would be terribly interested in them either beyond what I've said.

Consider it a study of controlled variables: keep things the same, but change the screen size. If the typing experience is better, then chances are pretty good that the screen size is responsible.

This is all about dismissing that extra 0.3" of screen space: you seem to think it's unimportant (but you have not actually tried it), and that is simply not what my experience has been.
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