04 Jul, 2010, Ssolvarain wrote in the 1st comment:
Votes: 0
I've been thinking about retheming stock rom to a sci-fi theme. Keep all the objects and mobiles and rooms where they are, just redescribe them. Keep the area list with the original name and the builder who modified the area. Keep the credits intact. Really spend time making the areas look good, going all out on the mob progs to deliver a smooth experience that plays out well.
I'd also like to see a few changes to the code, like real-time affects and a retheme/redesign of spells and skills. Bring in more functionality to mob progs.

The idea is to create a new base, zip it up and make it freely available. Maybe see a few more sci-fi muds instead of fantasy. Plus some of you might want to check it out simply to see how it weighs against the original areas.

I've been pirating some of Hades-Kane's server space to host a severely abused copy of quickmud.

As for the theme, I was thinking something with elements from Warhammer 40k's Imperium and space marines. A little Shadowrun. Some Under a Steel Sky. The man himself, Roger Wilco. The desert wasteland of Fallout. A sort of place where there's the normal 9-5 life you see every day, the high corporate life of the virtuous and the sleazy and the underside with backalley dealings you have to know some people to experience without getting your body scrapped for credits. Arcologies, the mandatory sewer with sentient killer slime, cheap hookers, cybernetic implants, futuristic sky scrapers, hookers, etc.

So, what do you think?
04 Jul, 2010, goran wrote in the 2nd comment:
Votes: 0
Sounds like a good time!
04 Jul, 2010, Runter wrote in the 3rd comment:
Votes: 0
I think it would be worthwhile if even just to see something different. :)
23 Jul, 2010, Kjwah wrote in the 4th comment:
Votes: 0
+1 internets if you do this.

and my <3 forever.
23 Jul, 2010, JohnnyStarr wrote in the 5th comment:
Votes: 0
it's a great idea. i've seen ROM bases out there that say they are sci-fi, or "star trek", and yet they
have: 'select class: Mage, Cleric, Warrior, etc'. i'm all for this plan, but i think that it would take quite
a bit of work to release a sci-fi ROM.
23 Jul, 2010, Ssolvarain wrote in the 6th comment:
Votes: 0
The bulk of the time will involve the areas. I'm checking the areas out right now and getting ideas about what I can do. Later on, when I've finished maps and notes, I'll redescribe them. Mprogs will follow that.

Code-wise, there's things that I'd like to see, but my primary agenda is just getting skills/spells/races renamed. A tick-per-second sort of deal would be pretty sweet. Visibly timed spells, with more over-time effects. Randomly generated dungeons with content would be cool. Maybe some form of coded implants, too. Anyways, I'm not really trying to start a mud. Just… do something.

All the time in the world :3
24 Jul, 2010, Parhelion wrote in the 7th comment:
Votes: 0
You guys better put on your Trollcap for this, but…

What would this really accomplish?

I understand if this is just some fun little thing you'd be doing for lack of interest in other projects, or because you just want to have fun writing object descriptions with no real concern for really releasing something useful. If that's your intent, then feel free to ignore me.

Yet, is taking stock and creating new stock, for the use of.. well.. STOCK… the most valuable contribution to be made to the MUD community? I understand that overall having a variety of available codebases to work from is useful for would-be developers in making their own games; however, don't you think we have a bit of a problem as it is with games running with ready-made material? If a developer wanted to open a MUD to make a sci-fi game, they could (and SHOULD) do this work themselves. In fact, by relying on the writing you will provide in this, they will be dropping the quality of their game significantly and hurting an already buttsore genre as it is.

Just you know… putting that out there.
24 Jul, 2010, Chris Bailey wrote in the 8th comment:
Votes: 0
Quote
Arcologies, the mandatory sewer with sentient killer slime, cheap hookers, cybernetic implants, futuristic sky scrapers, hookers, etc.


This is really just about hookers, isn't it? :P
24 Jul, 2010, Ssolvarain wrote in the 9th comment:
Votes: 0
Parhelion said:
You guys better put on your Trollcap for this, but…

What would this really accomplish?

I understand if this is just some fun little thing you'd be doing for lack of interest in other projects, or because you just want to have fun writing object descriptions with no real concern for really releasing something useful. If that's your intent, then feel free to ignore me.

Yet, is taking stock and creating new stock, for the use of.. well.. STOCK… the most valuable contribution to be made to the MUD community? I understand that overall having a variety of available codebases to work from is useful for would-be developers in making their own games; however, don't you think we have a bit of a problem as it is with games running with ready-made material? If a developer wanted to open a MUD to make a sci-fi game, they could (and SHOULD) do this work themselves. In fact, by relying on the writing you will provide in this, they will be dropping the quality of their game significantly and hurting an already buttsore genre as it is.

Just you know… putting that out there.


I've considered this, yep. That's why I'm not really interested in code changes. It doesn't take long to log in and check areas to see if the mud is stock or not. There's plenty of stock ROM muds wilting away out there. But, there's also a lot of muds that are stock/custom and do well for themselves with their own code changes and additions. By providing a sci-fi base, it may at least break the tedium. At the most, there might be a few more sci-fi muds that are easily accessible by diku-rivative players.


And yes… it is partially all about the hookers. I loved that part about Fallout 2's New Reno.
24 Jul, 2010, Kjwah wrote in the 10th comment:
Votes: 0
Parhelion said:
You guys better put on your Trollcap for this, but…

What would this really accomplish?

I understand if this is just some fun little thing you'd be doing for lack of interest in other projects, or because you just want to have fun writing object descriptions with no real concern for really releasing something useful. If that's your intent, then feel free to ignore me.


So, why release anything then? Thinking like this, everyone should start from scratch with no code to use for their MUD. :p Just because you don't find it useful doesn't mean other people don't. There's also people that like stock areas. o.O
25 Jul, 2010, Ssolvarain wrote in the 11th comment:
Votes: 0
Kjwah said:
Just because you don't find it useful doesn't mean other people don't.


That sums up my response. I'm not making the game for t3h trolls, I'm making it for myself. And if someone enjoys it, then whatever.
25 Jul, 2010, Idealiad wrote in the 12th comment:
Votes: 0
Kjwah said:
There's also people that like stock areas. o.O


I agree with this, and it seems like it's a sentiment often ignored in recent years. Good stock areas are like good games that you just enjoy replaying. For example imagine how silly it would sound to say that only one person in the world is allowed to have a copy of Super Mario Bros., and you need to go over to their house if you want to play it?
25 Jul, 2010, ralgith wrote in the 13th comment:
Votes: 0
Idealiad said:
Kjwah said:
There's also people that like stock areas. o.O


I agree with this, and it seems like it's a sentiment often ignored in recent years. Good stock areas are like good games that you just enjoy replaying. For example imagine how silly it would sound to say that only one person in the world is allowed to have a copy of Super Mario Bros., and you need to go over to their house if you want to play it?


Your argument is flawed.

The reason MUDs with stock areas tend to fail is because players don't want the same content on EVERY MUD they play. Some stock zones are OK… more if you "redo" them. Like the first MUD I ever played created their own starting town and redid Midgaard as a town taken over and destroyed by Demons. "The Ruins of Midgaard".
25 Jul, 2010, Ssolvarain wrote in the 14th comment:
Votes: 0
ralgith said:
Idealiad said:
Kjwah said:
There's also people that like stock areas. o.O


I agree with this, and it seems like it's a sentiment often ignored in recent years. Good stock areas are like good games that you just enjoy replaying. For example imagine how silly it would sound to say that only one person in the world is allowed to have a copy of Super Mario Bros., and you need to go over to their house if you want to play it?


Your argument is flawed.

The reason MUDs with stock areas tend to fail is because players don't want the same content on EVERY MUD they play. Some stock zones are OK… more if you "redo" them. Like the first MUD I ever played created their own starting town and redid Midgaard as a town taken over and destroyed by Demons. "The Ruins of Midgaard".


That's actually a very common thing. The newbie zone and midgaard tend to be complete with rewritten descriptions, which is actually sort of nice. I know what's where without having to do too much. If I'm operating out of one recall spot, I like to know how to get around quickly.
26 Jul, 2010, David Haley wrote in the 15th comment:
Votes: 0
Idealiad said:
I agree with this, and it seems like it's a sentiment often ignored in recent years. Good stock areas are like good games that you just enjoy replaying. For example imagine how silly it would sound to say that only one person in the world is allowed to have a copy of Super Mario Bros., and you need to go over to their house if you want to play it?

A better analogy would be several games having the first level from Super Mario Bros. presented identically. If only one MUD has the "SMB World", nothing prevents you from playing that MUD…
26 Jul, 2010, Idealiad wrote in the 16th comment:
Votes: 0
A mud doesn't exist in a vacuum. Perhaps someone you don't like or who doesn't like you is running it, maybe you're running it in your school's labs so the game is super responsive, maybe you're the owner or close to the owner and you can tweak elements of the game to remix it or experiment.

If we consider games as original works springing from the foreheads of their creators, to be experienced by a fickle and novelty-seeking crowd of players, the argument against stock is a good one, but that isn't the only way to create and play muds.
26 Jul, 2010, KaVir wrote in the 17th comment:
Votes: 0
It is not unusual for a popular mud to spawn imitations. Typically a group of veteran players (or sometimes even former admin) become angry at a recent change, or frustrated that a proposed change isn't made, or simply feel that they could do a better job of the mud overall. So off they go to create their own game - the goal being to create something exactly like the original except without the feature that "ruins the game", or with their proposed feature that will make it "the best mud ever".

I don't recall ever seeing such disagreements over the world itself, only gameplay features. If the original mud had stock areas, you can be pretty sure that the spinoff is going to use those same stock areas.

And while it's certainly true that some players hate stock areas, because they want to something new and original to explore, it's also true that some players love stock areas, because they don't want to spend time learning their way around a new world. Much like coded features, it seems the more popular approach to world building is to take existing areas (at least for the starting point) and give them a polish (perhaps a rename, change the descriptions, but retain a familiar area layout).
26 Jul, 2010, Rarva.Riendf wrote in the 18th comment:
Votes: 0
Just do whatever you want, but just saying…be sure about reading the limitation of ROM in the first place. Maybe not the best 'stock' code to start with.
26 Jul, 2010, Tyche wrote in the 19th comment:
Votes: 0
Rarva.Riendf said:
…be sure about reading the limitation of ROM in the first place.


Where can I read "The limitation of ROM"?
26 Jul, 2010, Deimos wrote in the 20th comment:
Votes: 0
Our little niche is getting smaller and smaller as time goes by, and the best way to discourage new game developers and hasten the demise of MUDding in general is to parade around on a high horse talking down to them for reusing stock codebases/content. Originality is great, but let's try to keep a positive attitude towards any willingness to keep the community going, shall we?

OP: I think your project will be great for the community. I had thought of doing this myself a long while back, after playing a sci-fi MUD (can't even remember the name now, but it was cool). I got side-tracked on other projects and never started it, though. Good luck, and let us know how it turns out!
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